(sorry for the you/her issue. this stuff was all originally journal entries, some directed at her, others meant for my psych/therapist)
Ignorance is bliss, for a while. Forgetting everything means forgetting the bad stuff, too. It means that as long as you're not actively angry at me, I forget that you're still hurting and everything in my little bubble is fine. My wife is happy, my baby is happy, so I'm happy. But that doesn't last forever. Only until the next fight. Which is inevitable, because the same issue that caused that last fight, the same issue I promised to fix, the same issue that I forget pisses you off, will happen again. And you'll get angry again. And I'll apologize and make promises again. But your heart grows a little bit harder, retreats into hiding a little bit more each time. Until finally there is nothing left. I have caused you to completely hide your heart from me. Not out of fear, or anger, but pain. And by then, it's too late.
It doesn't matter what songs I send you. I doesn't matter what letters I write you. I've said it all before. Promised relief, hope, change. Broken promises. Not because of hate, or spite, or malice. I had every intention of keeping every promise I've ever made you. And then a few days go by and my brain forgets that I ever said that. Even if I happen to realize I'm forgetting something, I try to remember, and get nothing.
I know that everything that is happening is the result of my actions, BUT I WANT TO BE ANGRY! I want to be angry over the fact that for the entire time I've ever known her she has abhorred cheating (due to her parents both cheating on each other time and time again), and then she cheated on me. I want to be angry that when I first found out and confronted her, she said they would stop (and the sex then got amazing, but apparently that was guilt? distraction?), and then I find out a month later that they were still seeing each other. "I care for him" she said. YEAH, AND I CARED ABOUT MY FRIEND BUT SHE WAS CAUSING US ISSUES SO I STOPPED ALL CONTACT WITH HER IMMEDIATELY (don't misinterpret this, though, this isn't about her. she's part of a past I've left behind). I want to be angry that she put up with my stupid bullshit for nearly 10 years, and then decides to leave when I finally get my head out of my ass long enough to actually follow through on getting diagnosed and starting meds and am now able to start making actual progress towards getting better. I want to be angry, but if anything I'm only angry at myself.
The current split of responsibility is weighted heavily towards me doing as much as possible. which not only do I not mind, I actively decline her assistance, encouraging her to get more rest. I view it as penance for what I've done. plus I hope that it leads to a change in her feelings towards me. I only have to get DD ready for school, while she watches DD all afternoon/evening, so there is that. Now, although I've become a proverbial doormat, she doesn't abuse it. but, she does utilize her new-found privilege. I watch DD on my nights off so that she can go hang out with her friends (and possible lover. I don't know the status of them, and frankly I don't give a fuck any more). but if we're done, what incentive do i have to continue down this path? currently i pay all the bills, and her money is mostly play money for her. so she has the funds to go to concerts, and events, and the bar, and out to dinner, and her games, and her coffee, while I've got nothing left over. there are also upcoming concerts where she needs me to take a vacation night to watch DD so she can go.
But I don't want her to stop doing any of that! I want her to still hang out with her friends. I want her to go to her events. I want her to be HAPPY. The only thing different that I want is to hold her hand again... to embrace her body.... to crawl into bed and the end of my day and pet her head and snuggle until I fall asleep...
But I recognize that maybe HAPPY doesn't include me by her side.
StartingOver, your post broke
Submitted by SpaceyStacey197... on
StartingOver, your post broke my heart. I am sorry that things have gone the way they have for you. If my H had done any of those things for me - I would not be here now.
I know that things might seem over with - but I hope that with you make thing the changes you are making she will see it. It could take a while, and it could be that she has "seen it before" - from your stated breaking of promises etc. Have you read Melissa's book? I think it would be very helpful for you - lots of good information for those WITH ADHD to help them manage their tendencies.
Even if things never work out with your wife again - learning to manage your tedencies long term will certainly benefit you and help you with your other relationships too.
I am sorry that it has come down to this, I am in the same boat - but the "other side" so to speak. However my H has no affection, love, care for me outside of being "civil" with me (as if I had caused some great harm to him and he has to work at being polite) until he leaves. My H has said he just doesnt love me - and frankly - I dont think he ever did. He never did any of the work he said he would do (per our Therapist)... never read a book, chapter anything at all. It wasnt worth it to him. At this point - I am pretty well convinced I have been nothing but an ATM to him (he doesnt work, I do).
So while my situation is a bit different from yours - I have spent the last 7 years dealing with someone who could not keep promises, and never would follow through - and that kind of pain is pretty deep. It has caused me to never believe his words, and only look at his actions... which at this point tell me everything I need to know.
Hang in there, and if you can stomach it - read some of our stories here, it might be hard, and it probably will be painful - but you can learn from them and maybe save your relationship. I really hope you do get to hold her hand again, and all those wonderful things again.
It is great that you are
Submitted by Girl1234 on
It is great that you are working toward getting it all together. It was also great to hear your side of the story because it gave me a different perspective on my H. I fear that our relationship is over now, but maybe there's hope that one day he'll figure out his issues, too.
Thanks for sharing!
I'm not perfect
Submitted by startingover8816 on
Stacey
I appreciate the kind words, but know that everything I say is filtered through my lens. So I try to be as forthcoming as possible about things related to me, and will purposely abridge most of her transgressions in order to balance the bias. I try to view things as objectively as possible, and the meds have done a *great* job of opening my eyes to my past actions. I have done some really crappy things to my wife over the years, and I have another post I'll put up soon (it's mostly done) about our story, at least from when things started headed downhill really badly. When it's done, I'll either add it to this post, or make a new one and link to it here.
I know that I have to change for myself, and that's that. Changing me for her will only either lay the groundwork for a very unhealthy future if we so stay together, or make me feel worthless or angry if she chooses not to stay. I'm trying to separate my actions from her needs. But it is so very hard. If you'd asked at any time in the last 14 years if I loved her, my response would have been "Of course! I'd do anything for her!" I've worked two jobs at times, done overtime when I could (even in past jobs I hated), and even donated plasma twice a week every week for over 4 years (I have a permanent scar at the venipuncture site from the 400+ donations). Anytime I would become frustrated or depressed about the situation, I told myself that I was doing it for her and DDs sake, that they make it all worth it. Because of the ADHD, my dad couldn't give me his incredible work ethic. But I did learn to emulate his intense passion to do whatever it takes to provide for my family. Turns out, I could do anything except what shes asks of me.
I do have Melissa's book. I'm I purchased it 2-3 months ago, between my unofficial diagnosis by my therapist and my psych appointment and official diagnosis. I'm not nearly as far through the book as I would like to be (only ~50 pages or so). I *would* say that it's because of all the new things I'm doing around the house I don't have time, but I know that's not the full truth. Yes, I have less free time now, but I know that I still relapse at times and spend too much time on the computer or on my phone. I'll notice that I've got more than enough time to do my housework, so I'll sit down for "just a minute." Before I know it, I've wasted too much time and have to RUSH to get things finished. It's why I've put off posting here. I could very easily get sucked into spending way too much here. But I'm in a good spot with my routine, and am only going to be on on my days off and on my lunch. I really wish that the audiobook came along with the print book, as I have a long commute and would have been through the book three times over already.
It's funny,when I first started researching ADHD, very few sites/posts mentioned it's possible effects on relationships, and the ones that did just glossed over it. I can't remember what prompted it, but one day I searched for "adhd marriage". Of course, this site was the first result. Reading different forums and articles, nearly everyone kept referring to Melissa and her book. I ordered it the next day, and cracked it open as soon as it arrived. I nearly cried. Reading through the beginning descriptions, they fit us to a T. Our (in)action / reaction / reaction loop, and where it had taken us in our relationship, was uncannily predictable. I found the forums and started lurking, reading *us* over and over again at different stages of our past. The only difference is so many of the spouses here have the terrible task of dealing with anger/abuse and addiction. I've been lucky to never really exhibit those traits. I've raised my voice to her less than a dozen times over the years, and my hand only once (about a year ago. A second later, when I saw the fear in her eye and realized what was happening, I broke down). It's more just inattention and apathy.
I'm glad that so many of you spouses are here, willing to share your stories and offer the other side. As I was writing this last night, I was texting my BFAM (brother from another mother :)), and I told him I was reading an adhd marriage forum. "ADHDers trying to make it work. spouses too. apathetic, hopeful, tired, angry. it hurts to read the bad stories, the ones that end with them walking away, but i force myself to read those ones too. i need to be realistic that it's not all snowflakes and gumdrops." It helps to reinforce in my brain just how dire the situation is. Reading someones story and thinking "wow,that's us" and it not ending well... it hits home.
On that note, I've found a lot of similarity and solace in 2 old posts by member DF, Does the anger ever really go away? and Does the anger ever really go away -> 2nd posting. He does a great job communicating a lot of the things that I'm still ruminating on. I've had a relatively short reflection time on my ADHD so far, so it really helps to clarify some things. Today, I randomly came across a post near the end (it's long, so I haven't read all of it) where he says "...when I wrote this original post several months ago I was, as you say, a "doormat". By my own definition a "doormat" is someone who functions for the sake of someone else, always seeking acceptance and never getting what they 'think' they should get or deserve in return." ... "I don't believe I'm a doormat anymore because I don't want anything in return." With what I wrote last night, it's very powerful. Anyways, this got much long than I expected (stupid hyper-focus!). I'll end with...
I, too, really hope I get to hold her hand again.
I think the hardest thing
Submitted by startingover8816 on
I think the hardest thing right now is the mixed signals.
We're "separated," but still live in the same home due to DD and finances. I sleep in DDs room, and DD sleeps wherever she falls asleep at. But my clothes and everything are all still in the master bedroom, so it's not at all odd for me to be in there. When my wife comes home from work, she will strip naked and change into regular clothes. She makes no effort to hid, and will have conversations with me while nude. Same with getting in to / out of the shower. This was all normal behavior before. I honestly don't think she thinks twice about it, and so don't think she's doing it to consciously hurt me. But it really, REALLY sucks to see my wife naked, to long for her, and know that I can't be with her.
When separation was first brought up a few weeks ago, she very cold to me. No physical contact, no "I love you," just very emotionally detached. I resolved that regardless if she reciprocated, I would still tell her I loved her, still offer a hug if she was sad. This has progressed to a nearly-normal level of contact between us. Laying on the couch, she would let me rub her leg. Hugs. Occasional I love yous as we were leaving the house. One morning, she even cuddled with me on the couch when it was time to get up (she'd had a bad dream). Yesterday afternoon, we'd had a great time. Pizza for lunch, watched tv together, joked and laughed... but then I ruined it. I moved too quick. We'd just embraced in a long, silent hug. One that I interpreted as us kinda saying to each other "Hey, I'm here." After, I went in for a kiss, and she recoiled. The image in my head of her grimacing and pulling away will take a long time to disappear....
She's agreed to go with my to my therapist (who also does marriage counseling) this week, but has said that she only wants to observe, and doesn't plan on saying anything. I'm hoping that once she gets in there, the therapist can prompt some dialog from her. I booked it as a two hour back-to-back, to give us ample time (I hate running out of time right as a therapy session is getting into a rythm...). Ideally, he'll see us each individually for a bit, then together. But he never returns calls or answers emails, so I'm not sure.
To counseling! ::cheers::
Startingover 1866...I am
Submitted by Zapp10 on
so glad your wife has agreed to the counseling.
Your post here has hit home with me, as the non adhd partner. I identify with her actions( tho where she is coming from could be different from me). I am so emotionally "blank" right now that I could not honestly say "how" I feel about my H at this time. And it makes me question my own self as to "not measuring up". I don't trust that I have a "valid" thought or emotion ever. I don't "trust" my H to NOT want "intimate contact" because ......? I can't put into words what has happened to me? It doesn't matter what has happened to me? I am just as confused and question EVERY move I make? Every word I say? I am VERY aware of what sex means to my H. It is validation that he is loved. He believes that any physical contact most of the time is a lead in to sex......meaning what I think is ....irrelevant, wrong,blah, blah,blah. My H has said MANY times that his "only" complaint with our marriage ....even to this day..." he would like to have had sex more often". Where as my complaint is...."stop treating me like I am interfering with YOUR life" WTH? For me....I don't get intimate with STRANGERS. If I can't TRUST you.......it ain't happening. How to explain "what" the effect of unaddressed adhd does to a person....and undoing that will not happen over nite.......maybe ....never. All sad.
I am NOT saying this is what is going on with you and your W. I am saying that intimacy suffers in so many ways to the unknown adhd and then once known...the "denial" that adds more years to the already sad situation unfolding. For me....because my H has JUST in the last few days made solid efforts to take action with his adhd I simply can't JUMP on board and believe..."all is going to be better". His ability to ...be patient and understanding" with what this has done to me is not something I can shove aside anymore. His ability to stop thinking about himself and PUT me in the equation will take time.....oh, dear....TIME.....the NOW, NOT NOW rollercoaster.
I am so rooting for you BOTH......you have no idea.....how the hope I want for myself....I want for you two.
P.S. I cannot say "I feel.." because that makes it about me......and that is not .....important? THIS is where I am at. So.......I don't feel......and it is not a good place to be.
Zapp - you have an amazing
Submitted by SpaceyStacey197... on
Zapp - you have an amazing way with words.
"I am so rooting for you BOTH......you have no idea.....how the hope I want for myself....I want for you two. "
Thats exactly how i feel too for StartingOver and his wife...
StartingOver
I wish that my husband had come to the place you are at. I wish with my whole heart that I had that same love coming from him - because I know that with that, we could accomplish anything, get THROUGH anything etc. I am certainly at a place that sounds similar to your wife (but with out the comfortable me being nude thing - which is something I have NEVER been with my H - though he is very comfortable being nude, undressed etc around me :-) ). Right now, we have short, barely "hearable" I love yous at night, and on the phone and when he leaves the house. But we have never had much of an affectionate relationship - what you and your wife have right now is something I would have envied from the get go of my own. So please understand that my hope/envy is totally flavored by my own sad experience of being with someone who would rather pull out his back doing gymnastics than have to touch me.
Wow... just writing that took the wind right out of me.
I hope that the counseling works out - it can be so wonderful regardless of the outcome. I am glad she is agreeing to go with you. I believe there is hope in your situation, as long as you commit to doing the work and give her a reason to believe in you and have faith in you again. From the sounds of it - it seems that she proabaly really DOES want to fix things with her comfort level and affection level. I believe when someone doesnt want to be with you at all - they shut you out completely. No emotional attachment what so ever. Pretty much exactly what I am trying to do in my own situation. I do not let myself have any emotional "stake" in anything my H does. I dont let myself feel joy for him, or sadness for him. I dont let myself worry about what he needs, or what he does. Funny enough the end result has been me treating him exactly as he has treated me for most of our 7 years together... (I realized that last night and it made me so sad!) The fact is - he doesnt want me, and I cannot continue investing into someone who doesnt want ME. It doesnt seem that is the case on your end - and granted, i am going off of what you say only. But to me, if she is snuggling on the couch - even though its not yet "romantic" that says alot to me.
Hell - for perspective... my H has NEVER ONCE wanted to snuggle with me on the couch. I asked once, and he rolled his eyes and got annoyed... Your wife might not be ready for romantic relations as that really does required an investment of the heart, she seems like she is not closed to the idea either. Take it a bit at a time, and you are doing the most important thing that there is - putting in the work with NO expectations from her. She has been down a hard road with you, its right and good that you bear the burden for a while so she can "rest" and rebuild. Look at it as filling up her "love" account, and not making any withdrawals right now. Let her get the balance she needs, and by showing the love you have, and by working on yourself and being OPEN about it you are on the right track.
Stacey-
Submitted by startingover8816 on
Stacey-
"I believe when someone doesnt want to be with you at all - they shut you out completely."
I think the same, and this has been a glimmer of hope for me the entire time. The fact that I'm still here in this home... the fact that it's talk of "separation" instead of "divorce"... hell, the fact that we can talk and laugh (although the conversations are light... I'm working with my T to get better at communicating about the heavy stuff) leads me to believe that there is a chance.
I have a question, for you or anyone else - how open of a "meta" dialog would you want? By that I mean, on the morning she came and laid with me on the couch, a few hours later I asked her about it. I'd gone back and forth trying to decide whether to mention anything or not. When I asked her about it, she said that she does miss things like laying with me and me petting her head while she falls asleep, but that there is just too much pain, and then she started to cry...
I feel like shes a pitcher in the middle of a perfect game, as long as I don't say anything about it, we can just keep on going right along.
But if I ask about it, the magic breaks down because everyone starts analyzing the situation. Like me asking just reinforces the idea that she has to tell me what to do.
But I think it's better to pull the cord and stop the bus to ask where we're going, than to do what I've always done and just enjoy the ride until it crashes due to me screwing something up and then wonder "what the hell...?"
If things are going well, even for just a short bit, would you want to have that conversation? If they were me, would you want to read their posts here about the relationship? Or would it bring more pain to think they can talk to strangers more easily than talk to you?
Zapp-
I am VERY aware of what sex means to my H. It is validation that he is loved. He believes that any physical contact most of the time is a lead in to sex......meaning what I think is ....irrelevant, wrong,blah, blah,blah.
I am very guilty of this myself. She has told me that on the occasions where she would deny me sex (not as a form of punishment but due to not feeling loved), she would finally relent not because the situation was better but because it was easier than dealing with my attitude. I would be able to weather the first few days with no problems (the cause of my "punishment" still fresh in my mind), but that as time went on I would become more and more overt about my desires. The more she would rebuke my advances, the more my libido would shoot up. I would make more off-the-cuff remakes, more crude jokes, more sexualized physical contact. Grabbing her butt in the kitchen (more than normal), her playfully telling me to go fuck myself about something and me responding "At least I'd be getting some action!" I would never do it with the intention to hurt her, but knowing what I know now about ADHD I know that this was 1. my desire for instant gratification and 2. me being completely self centered and giving no consideration of her thoughts/feelings.
...because my H has JUST in the last few days made solid efforts to take action with his adhd I simply can't JUMP on board and believe..."all is going to be better".
We all know that this has been my thoughts in the past. A few days of work, you're not actively made at me, so all is right with the world. I can't think that way anymore. I have to keep this up. I have to keep this up for the rest of my life, for my sake.
With my diagnosis, I realize that this is a marathon, not a sprint, and there is no finish line.
I just have to keep on running in that general direction, and hopefully, she will decide to join me.
Startingover.....You Asked?
Submitted by kellyj on
I have a question, for you or anyone else - how open of a "meta" dialog would you want? By that I mean, on the morning she came and laid with me on the couch, a few hours later I asked her about it. I'd gone back and forth trying to decide whether to mention anything or not. When I asked her about it, she said that she does miss things like laying with me and me petting her head while she falls asleep, but that there is just too much pain, and then she started to cry...
I have a simple answer. One my T gave to me....."Give her what she wants" I think there's a part two to that as well. Don't give her more than she wants....at least....for know?
I have to keep reminding myself of this too....KISS....keep it simple stupid. Don't think into this...any further than that.
You also brought up how much would I might want to hear....or coming hear reading or writing to "strangers" and how my wife might interpret that?
I want to hear and talk about anything...and everything....no matter how much it huts to hear it. But that's just me. I want this....but my wife doesn't not want this. KISS....again........
But....I also tell her...and have told her....and keep telling here again.....Why I come here....what I'm doing...and for what purpose does this serve....ME and US ....each time. Nothing is off the table with me...so I have no need....to keep anything from my wife...or make her feel suspicious. She didn't like it all that much at first....but when I discovered that journaling was really helping me here....and she saw how my communications skills were improving and making that connection....she eventually could see the benefit to her...and why this was important for me. I'm not going to go "without"...just to be with her and I can't speak openly like I would want to....but I'm not going to go find it else where.....that does not serve a purpose that is a benefit for both of us. It's serves a purpose....directly related to our relationship....improving my communication ability...and ME....since she is not open to talk about things I feel are important. She also....is not forth coming in how she feels or tells me things so coming here for example....is a safe, supportive source of good information I can use for both our benefits and....it serves Me as the same time to get my needs met....that aren't getting met by her without betraying myself or my wife at the same time. She's not getting less from me coming here for example....I still give that to her on a daily basis. But I have more to give than my wife wants right now....and all she wants is what she wants and nothing more.
I have needs to....but not at my wife's expense. Going back to....give her what she wants....but not more than she needs or can handle at any given time.
Our needs are different.....that doesn't mean I have to go without as long as I do it in an open and honest way that is neither hurting me or my wife...and that she can make that connection.
Mainly....I come here to hear....what my wife won't or can't tell me.( by hearing it from others and listening to what they say? Otherwise....I wouldn't have this need in the first place? But for now....this is all my wife has to give but that's also changing.....the more open and honest I am...and willing to expose myself to her to make her feel safe. I can say things here that I wouldn't say to her....but I also wouldn't feel ashamed necessarily...if she were to read anything here and the way I actually feel sometimes? I wish she would....but knowing...she wouldn't like it much to hear me be that brutally honest about my feelings....however, if that open honest communication that I would like to have with her was happening already....my feelings would be different...and so would the things I'd say.
You said I feel like shes a pitcher in the middle of a perfect game, as long as I don't say anything about it, we can just keep on going right along.
There you go....KISS...keep it simple stupid. And then let go of your guilt and forgive youself for any thing you know you did wrong....and don't do it again next time and keep going. That includes any punishment you feel you deserve..;or even don't deserve...and let go of that too. Just keep moving forward and leave the past behind you....saying....but learn from your mistakes and don't forget them...but don't let those mistakes prevent you from just trying again each time. Forward motion is good. Backwards motion is not so good. Leave it...and get on with it and try try again. You are your own worst enemy...if you're the one punishing yourself? You need to forgive yourself...and her....and leave it behind you each time you fail.....but don't forget...to keep moving and keep going in the same direction.
I think what has really helped me most....is not needing validation. No matter what I do....I either validate myself...or I don't....but I don't need it....even though, it's nice to hear sometimes but it's not necessary to keep me moving forward.
J
Just Keep Swimming
Submitted by startingover8816 on
No time for a full reply, but I will say this in response to "Just keep moving forward..."
I have a mantra that I (try oh so hard to remember to) read every morning when I wake up, written on the front page of my journal:
I'm not perfect, and I never will be perfect.
I can do better today than I did yesterday.
I can focus on the task at hand and
remain committed to my goals.
If I fail today, that's okay;
There will be another opportunity tomorrow.
Let go of the past, and
Just Keep Swimming
(Finding Nemo was the first movie my wife and I saw in a theater together, just as friends years before we started dating. I'd always liked Dory, but I couldn't pinpoint why. When the new movie came out, we went to see it in the theater as a way to reconnect as friends, a throwback to the past. I identified so much w/ Dorys "I'm sorry. I forgot." that I cried. It was tough to watch, but in a good way. So I've tried to adopt Just Keep Swimming for myself.)
I Like That SO
Submitted by kellyj on
It's hard to swim backwards! lol That really doesn't work very well. LOL
J
StartiingOver,
Submitted by SpaceyStacey197... on
StartiingOver,
i would say in answer to your question about conversations, that I probably would like them in a sense. If my h started turning himself around, and was sticking with it enough that we could enjoy each others company, it would be nice for him to just mention to me that he is working towards making things better. I am someone who needs words... I need to know what's going on. My h just ghosts me. I think he "thinks" he talks to me but it's all in his head. I only get responses about 30% of the time when it's me initiating the conversation. And generally he just doesn't at all. Though lately he has for logistical stuff around the house. If you click my name you will see my posts about the weird changes he has made over the last 3 weeks.
and I for sure agree with J. Give her what she is asking for but not more than that, don't push her. Keep being affectionate even if it's from a distance. Show her you have the perserverence I suspect she doesn't believe you have from you past behavior. My H doesn't even try. He is like a child who refuses to get back on the field just because he dropped the football. His automatic response is to quit. Now, granted that might have more to do with the very real question on what his motives were to be with me. Most everyone around us believe he has done nothing more than use me, and unfortunately, circumstantial evidence supports that theory. That he quits as soon as anything is even remotely not perfect is the worst thing he can do, as it reinforces that horrible theory and reinforces that he is just simply weak and immature. Show your wife that you are strong and getting stronger. That you are manning up and taking on your demons. And just like J says.. KISS. Let her have her mood swings as I am sure she is struggling ... On one hand she has probably been pushed farther than she ever thought she would have been in a negative direction. She has to fight her own instinct that is probably telling her that this will not last. She is probably torn between that love she has for you deep inside and a sense of survival that tells her to get out and run. That is gonna cause some shifts. And it probably will be just when you are feeling closest. Make sense? Understand it, embrace it and give her the affection AND space she needs.. When she needs it. Expect sadness, ANGER, gentleness, tears, genuine love, RAGE... Maybe all at the same time.
i love that you guys went to see the new memo movie!!! I love that it was a little, subtle way of you guys being able to remind each other that there is love under all of that. And maybe even hope. I won't be able to,watch it now with out thinking of you :). Keep on Swimming.... Love it!!! I wish my husband would keep swimming too... Prove me wrong and everyone else wrong while he was at it. Hell, if my H were to suggest watching an old favorite movie.. Like one of "our" movies... It would almost be a symbol of hope. I remember we had a time when things were bad, I had caught him lying about porn, a "deal breaker" for me. He asked to go to the movies to see Gullivers Travels... It was fun, and it made me feel hope. And believe me.... I was ready to walk out the door... Even found a new place to live... It would be pretty incredible on his part to have the thinking you have. I wish he knew you so he could see what it means to stand up, and do the work.
Stacey.....Something Caught My Eye
Submitted by kellyj on
What you said here... Most everyone around us believe he has done nothing more than use me, and unfortunately, circumstantial evidence supports that theory. That he quits as soon as anything is even remotely not perfect is the worst thing he can do, as it reinforces that horrible theory and reinforces that he is just simply weak and immature. Show your wife that you are strong and getting stronger.
There is this guy....and I have mentioned him before.....that I had the (displeasure/ to work with ?? Actually, by all accounts...he was a decent enough guy. But..(and I have no need to psychoanalyze him)...but, he was one of the strangest people I have ever met. Really. I worked with a lot of people in the work I use to do...both for me.....side by side with....beneath....and managed. I don't know what his issue was...but he was one of the most self sabotaging people I have ever met in the field I work with. He eventually ended up sabotaging me as well...but that's part of what you said as I got this same feeling. It was not his intention to sabotage me outright...but his need...not to fail or look bad....totally over rode his common sense. To the point....that he used me to meet his own agenda (what ever the Hell it was???) with an abandon and unawareness that was mind blowing. He did have some strange ideas about the way the world worked as well. It seemed to me....that his fear of failure and looking bad....caused him to actually believe he was way better at doing his job than he was to the point of being ridiculous. You could not tell him anything...and he would NOT defer. His blinders were screwed on so tight...that he really believed in things that truly were not there. Magical thinking...to an extreme level that I have never seen before? Too the point....that he believed he had healing powers and God went through his body, into his hands and he helped remove a demon from a person who was probably just sick. Then....that night (as he told me the story) he spent the night in the place where this happened (somewhere in the woods somewhere)...and heard noised like some animal outside grunting and sniffing on the other side of the wall....and thought it was the demon coming for him. I said..."where was this?" He said...."in some retreat like cabin for groups of people to meet in a forested area."
I went..."did it occur to you...that maybe, it was a racoon or maybe even a bear outside foraging for some food...since everyone left you there alone and what ever animal that was there...didn't realize you were still there? And it was night and they were hungry? And they had been there before and waited until they thought all the people were gone and that's when they go prowling around for things to eat?? Isn't that more likely...since it was in a forest where animals like that...actually live?????"
Nope. He exorcized this demon..and he was angry and had targeted him after him for releasing him from this person that God had worked through him to save. It happened just as he said."
Now....I'm not going to get into any discussions of criticizing anyones personal beliefs about demons and exocisizms....but circumstantially....but personally, I think it was a bear...and that person was just sick. Personally speaking.
And circumstantially speaking again....I saw the same thing play out in front of my own eyes and he did things that kind of said....that he was so afraid of looking bad or looking like a failure....that he had himself convinced of a lot of things about his abilities and better....liabilities, that went beyond reason or good practical sense. This was a case....of someone WAY over compensating for the fact that he actually was....one of the least talented and least productive employees I had worked for someone who had as many years of doing what he did...compared to anyone else I ever worked with out of say.....20 different people? To the point...that he taught people who wanted to learn how to do the work we did....and he was IMHO....the least qualified out of anyone I had ever met...to do the job. Even tough....he was a nice enough guy and had a good manner about him and spoke well. It wasn't a matter of not being personal or having an inability to teach people...it was WHAT he taught...and HOW he taught and what he believed that was no far off base.
I was thinking about the WOW game your husband loves he loves and that anachronistic stuff he likes to play with for fun? Thinking that your H may not be using you as much....as just believing a lot of things that just aren't true or realistic and lives in kind of that magical kind of thinking that has him convinced otherwise? And he really truly believes it sincerely...what ever it is?
That story of this guy I worked with sitll has me scratching my head to this day. I'm not maried to him or have to live with him and I don't hang around with him to enough of what the deal was with him (and don't actually care?)
But that was so weird..and the things he actually believed...that were so far fetched and the conclusions he would come up with sometimes....was not something I can really understand exactly WHAT his motivation was for doing things.
Even if I give some room to believe in the power of God and things like demons and the like....most likely and more probable...that a raccoon or bear was prowling around for food after all the people went home and that was what he heard sniffing and grunting ar outside, in the forest...at night? Now what I mean?
J
J - you are spot on in alot
Submitted by SpaceyStacey197... on
J - you are spot on in alot of your assessment. When H quit WOW "for good" - one of the things he said he realized was the false sense of accomplishment, and how it made he feel like he had power and control. Things he DID NOT feel like he had as a child (going through the abuse). That and he realized how much time he had given to the game, and how he really didnt have any ACTUAL real life control when he WAS playing the game. Thats where his magical thinking comes in - in believe in false control. He thinks "being in control" is following every whim, and every desire he wants at the moement he wants it. Something like WoW seems fun again? Then he thinks he is in control if he plays it again because he WANTS to. (nevermind the damage and harm he knows it will do - because "this" time he thinks it will be different somehow, kinda like the alcoholic says "its just one beer"). He thinks that when he quits because something is hard, or doesnt go exactly right on the first try - then that is him BEING IN CONTROL because he doesnt want to do it again. Like doing the work the T advises. He thinks that he is "in control" when he doesnt read the books or articles etc that I or his T will ask him to read because he isnt in the mood to, and "we" are trying to control him by asking him to do it - so that he can at least get some self help since he refuses to do the other stuff. He thinks he is "in control" when he stuffs his face with snack cakes and candy - because he is eating what he wants WHEN he wants- nevermind the long term goals he says he wants to accomplish. He thinks he is "in control" when he breaks promises and vows just because he isnt in the mood to keep them at the moment - and any reaction from me is just an attempt to "control" him.
Magical, warped thinking about what being in control really is. And I absolutely - with out a single doubt - believe with all my heart that because his only real "accomplishement" in life has been "in game" (in WOW specifically, but he did well in SWTOR too) that he looks back at that time as some sort of peak for himself. That he was "in control" of himself and environment and "LOOK AT WHAT HE DID!!! He is an amazing 82 level Paladin or what ever".... forgetting that while in game, his daughter was tucked into bed by her grandmother, his daughter did her homework with the help of grandma and grandpa, grandma and grandpa were the ones playing with her on the swingset, grandma and grandpa were the ones she talked about her day to, grandma and grandpa were the ones who fed her, bought her clothes, helped her when she had problems with friends, held her birthday parties, comforted her when sick - all the things a parent should do. All this things went one for years - less than 1 mile away from where my H sat, on his computer chair, chainsmoking and playing WoW and watching porn.
And, I can see it - he wants to go back to that life. Because REAL life is harder than WoW. Real life contains responsibilities, and real life people have expectations that dont turn off when your computer turns off. Real life is also alot better in 10000000000 different ways. And if he cant see that or understand that - and wants to feel "in control" again being some character on a computer screen - made of pixels- with people who dont care anything about him other than what value he provides to their raid - so be it.
I am done fighting it - I wont enable it, and I will not participate in his life when he leaves here because that will be too painful to watch. Its sad, and pathetic to me that someone with the talents and gifts he has to want to be "that guy" who lives off his friends in a spare room, with no real career, no prospects for anything, spending his time and money being "in game" while life happens around him. His daughter is going to be 15 years old this year. Soon - she will be grown and living a life of her own choosing. With out his mother's intervention of making things "happen" like visits etc... whats gonna happen there?
I can waste my time worrying about where he will be in 5, 10 years.... but I know the answer already. As much as I hate it. So I have to let go of it - focus on myself. Focus on the life that I want to lead... one where I see the world, visit friends, live healthy and strong so that I can ENJOY things. I could never fathom life in a dark room looking at a screen for fulfilment. I read this quote on a WoW recovery page (its as addictive as gambling and finally getting treated as such).
"The question is....will you be able/courageous/adult enough to sacrifice that which merely pleases you...for that which will truly fulfill you? That is the question of personal growth."
I think it applies to everyone, but ESPECIALLY the ADHD/ADD person - as understanding the difference between the two, and then fighting the temptations of the former is much more of a challenge.
And just like J says.. KISS.
Submitted by startingover8816 on
And just like J says.. KISS. Let her have her mood swings as I am sure she is struggling ... On one hand she has probably been pushed farther than she ever thought she would have been in a negative direction. She has to fight her own instinct that is probably telling her that this will not last. She is probably torn between that love she has for you deep inside and a sense of survival that tells her to get out and run. That is gonna cause some shifts. And it probably will be just when you are feeling closest. Make sense? Understand it, embrace it and give her the affection AND space she needs.. When she needs it. Expect sadness, ANGER, gentleness, tears, genuine love, RAGE... Maybe all at the same time.
So, at the same time you were writing this, we were having a fight. It started because when she left for work this morning, she forgot to put the lock back on the bathroom door. So when DD woke up, she got into mommys makeup. Ruined close to $80 worth of stuff, and possibly more (she has to see if the eye shadow palettes can be cleaned. If they go, we're now closer to $200). I was still asleep, and situations like this are why we have locks on the outside of all the bedrooms and bathrooms. When mommy came home, she was upset. I knew she was going to be, so it didn't bother me. When she asked what happened, I said "the lock wasn't put back on the bathroom door." I tried to be very calm and non-judgemental when I said this. I knew that she had only gotten about 2 hours of sleep last night, and so it was an honest mistake. We've been dealing with stuff like this from DD for many years, so cleaning it up didn't bother me, and unfortunately it's the first time W has had some of her makeup ruined. It's tough to replace when we don't have much money to begin with. But W tried to take it out on me, saying that I had a accusatory tone when I said the lock was off, and implying that I should have been awake. I will take responsibility and everything that comes my way for every mistake I've made, but I won't get yelled at for something that wasn't my fault. We have the locks for a reason. DD could have done this at 4 am... was I supposed to have been up then as well? I told her I understand that she's upset, that I don't mind her being upset over the situation, but that I would appreciate her not take it out on me.
That argument then moved on to us. Details include (among other things) her stating "We.will.not.get.back.together.", her calling me a "delusional idiot" for holding out hope, her deciding that she is going to quit her job, sign over all parental rights to DD, and go live in a homeless shelter, and finally that she is leaving me and having the other guy come pick her up. Just after leaving, we had this text message exchange. I also sent her an email (below the texts), but I don't know if she's read that yet. If so, she hasn't responded.
I know that she hurts, more than I have the ability to comprehend because I've never felt pain like that. Even when things have been bad, it pales in comparison to the years of suffering I've caused her. So as you said, I expect sadness, ANGER, gentleness, tears, genuine love, RAGE... Maybe all at the same time.
I'm just trying to be whatever she needs me to be.
SO8816
------------------------------
W: I'm never coming home 4:12 PM
W: Goodbye SO8816 4:12 PM
SO8816: For DDs sake, if you're thinking of hurting yourself, please don't. She doesn't deserve to not have a mother because of my mistakes.She needs your love too. 4:17 PM
W: I'm not gonna hurt myself. But I just am not coming home 4:20 PM
W: I don't want to be there 4:21 PM
W: I can't do anything 4:21 PM
W: I can't pay bills 4:21 PM
W: I can't care for DD except for emotionally but that ain't paying the bills 4:21 PM
SO8816: I disagree, but I dont want to argue. The door will always be open to you if you want. 4:30 PM
W: Fuck that. Why would I want to come back to where I am not appreciated 4:31 PM
W: I honestly just don't know what to do 4:37 PM
W: I don't want to be any where near you 4:38 PM
SO8816: You've always been appreciated, but I fucked up and never made sure you knew that. 4:38 PM
W: But you've made it to where I have to be so co dependant 4:38 PM
W: I need you to survive and it sucks 4:38 PM
SO8816: I can understand that. If you want, we can work out some schedule where we're not at the house at the same time. 4:38 PM
W: That's fucking stupid 4:39 PM
SO8816: we were supposed to be partners, a team, and I failed miserably holding up my side of that. 4:40 PM
W: It's fine. I might need you to come get me depending on how fucked up i get 4:41 PM
SO8816: youve always been there for me, and i've only been there for you when it met my selfish needs 4:41 PM
W: I left my meds at home 4:42 PM
SO8816: do you need them? 4:42 PM
W: Nah it's cool 4:42 PM
SO8816: ok. 4:43 PM
W: I will let u know 4:43 PM
SO8816: kk 4:44 PM
--------------------------
4:14pm
Subject: "Can you feel me?"
Body:
I haven't felt you in a very long time. Not since before we were married. I never thought that was the case, but I realize now it's true. I haven't felt you until recently, and now all I feel is pain.
I'm sorry that I wasn't able to provide you the life I promised so many years ago.
None of this is your fault. My words and actions through the years may have said that it was, but it wasn't true. I can see clearly now, the fog has lifted, and I can tell you that this was one hundred percent my doing.
You aren't leaving me... I pushed you away. I never considered your thoughts and feelings. I was narcissistic, controlling, a liar... In a word, an asshole. I tell myself that it was never done with malice or hate or the intention to hurt, but it doesn't matter why, the bottom line is you paid the price for my mistakes, and I can't undo that. Your wounds are too deep, the scars too many.
I hope that we can remain civil, at least for DDs sake, and that in time we may even become friends again.
Hurting you is my biggest regret in life. I will carry the burden of what I've done with me forever.
I know right now that you want nothing from me, and I understand that. But know that if you ever need anything, I'll be there for you to do whatever I can.
Don't ever doubt yourself. You were an awesome girlfriend, an amazing wife, and are an incredible mother. Don't let my actions determine your self worth. You're smart, strong, beautiful, and incredibly driven. I know that you will make it through this and come out better on the three side.
I've done a really shitty job showing it throughout the years, but I'll say it now so there is no confusion:
I love you. I have always loved you. I always will love you. You will always occupy a special place in my heart. You were my first love, my passion for life, my soulmate.
Goodbye, my <petname>.
SO8816
SO, with out really knowing
Submitted by SpaceyStacey197... on
SO, with out really knowing your wife's perspective, it sure seems that she is in a pretty severe crisis. She sounds confused on where things stand and her role in everything. She sounds like there is some guilt and shame that is really weighing down on her, at the same time some major anger on things getting to this point and her rage at you and feeling like it's your fault.
Have tou you told her that you are not leaving her until you both agree that things are said and done? Maybe she just can't get her "footing" on stable emotional ground from everything that has just happened.
I would kindly suggest that that you try not to read into her tone. That accusation all tone towards you sounds a lot like her feeling really stupid on top of all the other stuff going on. She might just need a break and get to a place in her head where she can start sorting and making sense of stuff where she isn't in. Hind brain mode?
Take this in stride. Be there for her, help her clean things up, let her know that what ever can't be salvaged will be replaced. That everything will be ok, just take one step at a time. I know this is hard for you, because you are having to learn how to step up right when shit is real you know?
Startingover........
Submitted by Zapp10 on
Can I just say....while I suspect "emotionally" I may be identifying with your wife......I DO see you have way more insight or are atleast "learning" how that"nasty little snot" adhd causes so much trouble for YOU and at the same time your W. I sincerely applaud your sincerity. It does not sound to me like your W is absolutely checked out. I find myself "caught" not knowing WHAT to do. I do not want to do anything that appears....mothering, bossing, pay back...etc. And yet I am leery of "something" coming from within that will be "out of control" and THAT is not the answer either......ya know....like sucker punch the sob.....see? I HATE that I even THINK things like that! My H IS NOT an sob!! For me right now steering clear and minimal contact is the safest for both of us.
I think you are very much headed in the right direction.......buckle up....it may take awhile......
I've always been able to
Submitted by startingover8816 on
I've always been able to detach myself and look at a situation objectively. It has helped a lot in my self-reflection, being able to realize how badly I've screwed up our relationship. The tough part is following my own advice. I've always thought the detachement might make good therapist....
It's great for self analysis.
Submitted by SpaceyStacey197... on
It's great for self analysis... Not so great when trying to be a husband. :).
Ain't that the truth...
Submitted by startingover8816 on
Ain't that the truth...
Even better, Stacey
Submitted by Zapp10 on
I so love when ones can articulate their thoughts. YOU did a great job responding to startingover.....in my opinion. and yes.....it is HARD when the adhd spouse comes here and puts their heart out there.....I feel as much for them as I do the spouse.
I believe my H is becoming more and more aware......that he has been clueless....how the adhd shows up and I am pretty sure he gets that something is even more AMISS with me than he has ever wanted to address. I so wish he would get "help". I AM NOT in any frame of mind to do that currently. I am remembering the phone call that told me my daughter was dead and I just wanted to run SCREAMING outside into the night...........THAT is how I am feeling these days. I cannot sort out WHERE I am and where I am going. What do I want? Sweet Jesus!......I want a margarita.
By the way startingover...
Submitted by Zapp10 on
I am sorry......that your wife cheated. I forgot that in reading your post. There are a million "reasons" to TRY to justify cheating. While I say I "identify" with her it is up to that point.....meaning......I have found myself thinking..."what's it like to be seen/heard by a man?" I have forgotten.....and then it takes EVERYTHING I have to stop that train of thought. I CANNOT go there.Don't ask me why......maybe it's because I would be "settling" for a moment of "nice" and then find out.....it wasn't "true" ......Just like where I came from. For me....it would not be for sex......I just want to HEAR and FEEL like I am worth it...... and believe it's true.......uh, bartender......another margarita please:-)
Zapp, I could not agree more
Submitted by SpaceyStacey197... on
Zapp, I could not agree more if I tried. Before, I could never fathom even wanting to cheat. But now I get it. I can understand how temping it is especially when someone offers the compliments and attention that you don't get from your spouse.
I never would have thought 7 years ago that cheating on my spouse would even cross my mind. I was so deeply in love that I became essentially a doormat. I would put my faith and belief from my very core into the words he would say. And he treated me very poorly. Still... I believed things would get better, so I swallowed the pain and hurt, and tried to ignore his actions instead focusing on his words. Big mistake...
While I would never actually cheat on him, that is more for my own control and morality at this point instead of loyalty to him. He has deprived me of any real attention and affection for so long that it does make me day dream and wonder about the what ifs with other men who have approached me.
Like you Zapp, I just to feel and hear that I am worth it too. I want to know that my husband would go to hell and back for me when I have done the same for him over and over. I want to feel that even if we are upset with each other it's just a chance for is to grow together. I wanted that with my h. The reality is... Here I am, preparing myself for him to leave, and starting to think about what my life will be like with out him.
SO, I know getting over her cheating will be hard, especially once you get past the desperate phase of your current crisis. But I hope that both you and she can put the past behind you, as I am sure there is lots for her to forgive as well. Don't let the sins of the past committed in a time of darkness prevent you both from finding happiness in the light.
A Real Reason Someone Might Cheat
Submitted by kellyj on
While I was reading what you guys wrote...I remember meeting a friend in a bar for a drink after work...and when he was leaving...a women sat down next to me and the bar tender and I were talking with my friend and I. This was at time when my ex-wife would not come home and kind of disappeared in my life and I had my own feelings about this at time. One of the reasons I was there since she wasn't home and I didn't feel like coming home to be alone.A
Anyway...as soon as friend my left...I was still chatting with the bar tender and this woman piped up and joined the conversation. I was about to get ready to leave myself as soon as I was finished with my drink and this woman offered to buy me another one. Clearly.....this was an overture on her part that said she was interested in me and wanted me to stay. I did oblige her and the three of us sat and chatted while she was really showing interest in me.
All I can say is....this went no where but I did end up playing some pool since she expressed that she thought that would be fun and I was in no hurry to come home and be by self at the time. What I remember however....was how wonderful and good that made me feel....just having a woman (who I thought was attractive) show interest in me in a way that said...."I'm attracted to you...and I would like to get to know you."
Just feeling that again after so long of feeling neglected and discarded....would be enough to make someone want to cheat I can tell you. I had no intention of cheating and I ended up not taking her up on the offer...but it was tempting because of how good that made me feel at a time...when I was not feeling very attractive and felt completely worthless and devalued. Just that....was enough...to make me feel better and not feel so worthless...even without doing anything more than having a drink and shooting a game of pool and leaving like I should....but not without thinking twice before I did.
J
It's crazy...because I have
Submitted by SpaceyStacey197... on
It's crazy...because I have had similar experiences. And while it feels great when it's happening, like water to a parched desert flower, the impact later is devastating at least for me it has been in the past. It just reemphasizes to me that I want that attention and interest from my husband.... And it never comes.
I've been dealing with life
Submitted by startingover8816 on
I've been dealing with life today, but I have kept up and read the posts here.
As the ADHD partner, I can say that the feelings behind cheating go both ways. Part of our past (and this is why I said to keep an open mind about my story, there are still some disclosures to make that may change your mind about me) is that I emotionally cheated on my wife. I was in the same boat. Her constant nagging of me, belittling me over my mistakes, her anger of what I saw as minor things... they made me *think* I wasn't in love any more (I say that because, looking back, I've never not loved her). I started to grow closer to a co-worker (this was the "friend" that I stopped all contact with, OW). Like J said, "how wonderful and good that made me feel....just having a woman (who I thought was attractive) show interest in me in a way that said...."I'm attracted to you...and I would like to get to know you."
It was intoxicating. OW, of course, didn't have years of built up resentment, so small things like forgetting to call her when I said I would were just that, small things. OW liked me for me (at least the me she knew). It wasn't until recently that I was able to look at that situation for what it was, cheating. I deluded myself into thinking that it was nothing more than a friendship. We never had any physical contact beyond a hug hello and goodbye. But I used her to feel better about myself, while ignoring the pain and suffering my wife was enduring, keeping a home and raising a child all alone (she might as well have been).
So, those feelings of desire can cut both ways.
S
SO - I dont think it matters
Submitted by SpaceyStacey197... on
SO - I dont think it matters if you have ADHD or not - cheating can happen and be a temptation regardless. If there is strife or pain, and especially neglect on the part of any partner in a relationship - that becomes a temptation. And while - for me PERSONALLY... its a total 100% dealbreaker, I know that others have gotten past it and been able to heal and have amazingly strong relationships that were extremely happy afterward. I just know that I could not get over something like that in my own life. Make sense?
I certainly can see how easy it would be to slip into an emotional relationship with someone else (even if there is no physical aspect). I actually have had to fight that very recently when I found myself relating to and bonding with someone. I realized that I had to be very careful, that even though I know my H has said he doesn't love me and is leaving our relationship - and honestly, he has neglected me for so long that I am pretty sure I could literally be having sex with someone and him walk in on it and he wouldn't even care and PROBABLY would not even notice!!! - I know *I* made a vow... and I will not be a vow/promise breaker. It damages me as much as it can damage the other person.
So - while I enjoy this friend's company, and certainly the attention is almost intoxicating, I have been very very very very careful that I do not allow myself to let it get any farther than a normal friendship. I really work hard to make sure I never say anything that I would not be able to say right in front of my H. And even though many would say it doesnt matter, the fact is - it really DOES matter. It matters very much to me that I do not break my vow and promise to him. Saying that - it sure hurts like hell that he doesnt value the promises and vows like I do. So when its all said and done, I will be able to let go and not let it hurt me any more.
So - after that LONG winded lead up - LOL What I am getting to is this... when you break a vow or promise as important as your wedding vows, and pledges of fidelity to your spouse, it not only hurts THEM, but it absolutely destroys you. It takes your legs out from under you. It makes you feel less than because your actions were "less than". It strips you of your own nobility and makes you feel low. I personally think its a part of promise breaking that people overlook - and its why its so hard to get past things, even if your spouse forgives you. I really think my husband has harmed himself as much as he harmed me by breaking his promises to me over the years. Even though I have forgiven him. Because he did it in the past, he thinks its too hard to continue to keep them in the future - but thats just that guilt and shame that HE has to let go of. And that takes work, takes humility, and takes time - time from the moment you realize it.... which can be years after the fact.
So- you and your wife have much to forgive - both for eachother and for yourselves. Please aknoweldge it with yourself and with your wife, and know that it CAN be done.
So - while I enjoy this
Submitted by startingover8816 on
So - while I enjoy this friend's company, and certainly the attention is almost intoxicating, I have been very very very very careful that I do not allow myself to let it get any farther than a normal friendship. I really work hard to make sure I never say anything that I would not be able to say right in front of my H.
I wish I'd been able to maintain that outlook when I made the mistake I did.I say "maintain" because on a conscious level, if you'd asked me my answer would have been "of course not! I'd never cheat on my wife, regardless of what's going on in our relationship." I let that little snot ADHD (as you so eloquently put it lol) and the narcissism and self-gratification cloud my judgment. I've vowed to both my wife and myself to never let that happen again.
Swimming SO
Submitted by kellyj on
My mother...(bless her heart) had my best interest in mind when she made me sit and wait an hour after I ate...before I went swimming when I was really little. She probably heard that from her mother who told her the same thing. As she said it to me."If you don't wait an hour before you swim....you'll cramp up and drown."
And she believed it...so she made me wait an hour before I swam after I ate anything.
This of course....is conplete none sense. Getting into water after you eat food....does not cause you to cramp up and drown. Even if you cramped up for what ever reason....you are necessarily going to drown either. I can tell you....I've cramped up so many times swimming from working out so hard that the blood ran out of my muscles....that I cramped up severely....and I never drowned? Not only did I not drown....I actually kept swimming or just swam to the wall and got out and rested. Either way.....cramping up is not the problem. Neither is eating before you go swimming. Neither does getting wet or going in the water cause you to cramp up?
I'm assuming.....somewhere....at some time in the past......someone ate food, got in the water and swam....and then drowned so who ever saw this said....."food.....water.....cramping.....drowning" Must be it? Right?
Wrong. No mater what you believe is true.....or believe for yourself and live by as a rule. That little snot ADHD is over riding your thinking and your good judgment in the moment....and impulsively acting on your impulses to do what ever you did....and thinking or believing...has very little to do with it.
Everything is about "this moment"....not the past ones...or what you believe you will do once you get there. This moment...is all about "impulsivity" and nothing else. And that Narcissism...is just the side effect of your impulsivity....that's not the problem. Control the impulses...and the Narcissism will go away along with it.
And self gratification is not the problem either......immediate gratification is....to put it simply. (in the moment)
J
J- I saw this on a wow detox
Submitted by SpaceyStacey197... on
J- I saw this on a wow detox page...
"The question is....will you be able/courageous/adult enough to sacrifice that which merely pleases you...for that which will truly fulfill you? That is the question of personal growth."
adhd for sure makes it harder to find true fulfillment.
You're right in that there is
Submitted by startingover8816 on
You're right in that there is no *good* reason to cheat. But I know why it happened, and I don't hold it against her. It hurts, but I'm not angry. Like I said, there are certainly times that I want to be angry over it, that I want to yell at her, but I know that 1. My actions were the root cause, and 2. yelling at her wouldn't do any good. So I accept that it happened, forgive her for it, and choose to move past it. I told her in an email recently, "You could tell me that you fucked him in our bed, on my birthday, and I would still forgive you." And it's true. There's a reason I chose "StartingOver" as my sn. I am truly trying to let go of the past and not let myself get angry at something I can't control. The past happened, there's nothing I can do about that. But I choose whether or not to let it control my life.
"The past happened, there's
Submitted by SpaceyStacey197... on
"The past happened, there's nothing I can do about that. But I choose whether or not to let it control my life."
This is incredibly profound. And personally I think it's the secret to life, at least having a good life. Hang on to that as it is your lifeline to better things. I wish my husband could understand it.