I just need to admit this and deal with it. I saw signs of him "resigning himself" nearly 20 years ago and failed or refused to see those signs as red flags. In these past two decades, it has slowly, progressively gotten worse. Whenever I brought up ADD, he'd fly off the handle.
My husband (it was a huge surprise with no warning or discussion) retired (very) early immediately after I got a big promotion at work. I probably should have divorced him then. I'm not sure why I didn't. The message was so clear. It was also around that time that he began withdrawing from the outside world (worse than before). Through the years, he has become less . . . capable, needier, having problems with the simplest of tasks. Yes, it's the ADD with age added, a health issue added, and his decision not to address any of these issues or work to push through. He has surrendered. How anyone throws their arms in the air like this is beyond me. But I believe now that the "surrendering" part of his personality was always there. . . it was just lurking in the background.
We've been married a long time. I am not in a time in my life when I can just pick up and leave. That would throw me back financially to an unthinkable position. I didn't put all of this into this life and marriage to end up screwed and struggling just as I approach retirement age.
Yes, I have a life outside of our home. I'm active in the community. I work. My husband doesn't join me in any activities any longer--he won't even go to the community farmers market with me. We have a gym membership. He hasn't been in months and says he doesn't intend to go (but continues to pay the membership). He has no idea about the projects I am working on even at home. I hardly share anything with him any longer because of lack of interest or that he doesn't listen and will forget what I've said 10 minutes after I've said it. It's almost as if he's subtly pushing me toward an affair (I will not do that).
He spends his days not only sitting in front of the TV but constantly--and I mean constantly--on Instagram. He will have the TV volume up along with the volume on his phone (this is a new one). It is an addiction and an obsession. He's gaining weight. He has a sugar addiction. His diet focuses on pizza and fried foods . . . and he has a heart condition. He refuses healthy foods. Yes, we eat separate meals for the most part.
My next big push is another doctor's visit. This time with me present. It will be my last effort. It will be hell to get him there. In the meantime, I'm trying to straighten out our wills (which he is being difficult about) because I don't know what else to do except to get ready for him disappearing altogether, which he seems to be actively working on. How was any of this ever acceptable to me? What was I thinking? And how do I even go forward with all of this?
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Parasitism
Sorry, but it sounds so much like your husband has let go of everything, expecting you to provide for him. It’s parasitic, it feeds off a spouse’s mental health.
It wouldn’t surprise me if he’d bounce off that bed and get busy with life if he one day couldn’t rely on you. My ex did. It seems to be partly situational incapacity. I for one have sworn to never again allow such behavior, whatever may be the cause.
About resources, I can totally relate. It’s hard to realize all one’s worked for - a home, a family, funds for recreation and security - will crumble if the marriage dissolves. Still, the GP who told me to get a divorce said: just sell the house.
He seemed like he saw my type of patient all the time. The tortured wife of a mentally ill husband who’d abandoned her with all responsibility and checked out emotionally, spending all day in bed and on devices. And she didn’t want to lose her lifestyle. The GP was obviously sick of it.
Just sell the house, he said. A one-bedroom apartment in a different part of town is also a home. Find something else. Discover something. Because if you stay, you will go down, and your children will go down with you.
It’s not been comfortable. I’m poorer, sure. But divorce basically saved me.
I'm not sure he would
I don't think my husband would suddenly become a competent, independent adult if I left. I look back in hindsight to his life before we met, some things that came to the surface later and other things that I probably was in denial about: a terrible divorce, a bankruptcy (that he hid from me for years), extreme over-spending, and job loss (fired once, laid off later). A lot of this (how awful the divorce was and how it would impact our lives, the financial issues, and then different stories/excuses for being fired) was either hidden from me or highly misrepresented. But his apparent inability (which seems to be getting worse) to operate like a competent adult in the world is not why I won't/can't leave.
After decades of working hard, I finally caught a break and was able to scale back to part-time work. Because of a chronic illness (not devastating by any means), I just don't see myself capable of working another full-time job and being able to do anything but sleep in my spare time. I see leaving as running through my savings within a couple years. I've let too much time pass.
I left a marriage in my early 30s and "started over" in a new town, new job, new everything. Even at that age, it was very difficult, although I don't regret it. Now, I just don't see myself in a good situation at all should that be the road I take. I could kick myself.
So sorry
I’m so sorry to hear this. Also apologize about how I may have come across. Every person’s situation is unique, and of course I don’t know what your best options are.
However, I have so much empathy for how hard it is to handle a slow slide in functioning like you describe in your husband. How could you have known? He wasn’t upfront about his past and then there’s been a slow gradual decline.
I sometimes think about moving in with one or several woman friends as a way to cut costs dramatically. Could that be an option to solve a need for working too much?
I wish you the very best.
Thank you!
Oh, no - you did not come across in a bad way at all. I got exactly what you were saying, as I was there in my 30s (why I mentioned that time in my life) only under different circumstances (not ADHD!). And I really do appreciate your empathy. I am so mad at myself for not catching things--or acting--earlier, when I was better able to!
As I mentioned also, I am in a slump or downward spiral right now, so I know things may be looking up next month and I will feel better able to handle everything. It's just that I'm so tired right now.
When I regain the energy, I know I need to have (another) heart-to-heart with my husband. There are phases where he "tries," and it's kind of pathetic because he's like a puppy that doesn't know what it doesn't know. He "tries" and then he gives up when, in reality, I believe the (or an) answer would be to get a diagnosis from a doctor and get on meds, for God's sake! It is unreal to me how people resist the simplest and best answers.
I may have mentioned in here before that my husband went on Prozac years ago for depression. It was like magic! He was alert, present, very functional, and he was reading (which he normally has a hard time doing). Now, he misreads things, mispronounces things, stares at the TV 24/7, can't remember details of what anyone says to him. I would imagine that would cause someone to "give up," but giving up is still the wrong path to take.
Thank you again. (Yes, I have thought about a community of women, too. I have some older divorced and widowed friends and have wondered if we shouldn't create an old-age life together in the future. A longtime friend whose husband is not in good health has been reaching out a lot to me this past year.)
Everything you’re saying
Everything you’re saying rings so true - the slow onset that you meet with accommodation. The step-change degradation of ability as situational windfalls allow it - so sudden that you believe it must be just another extreme mood that will pass by morning, until you realize decades later that your own life changed substantially and irrevocably that day. The disregard or maybe distain for their own bodies, self-satisfied in the rational that it’s their own body and nobody has any interest in it
Everything you’re saying
Everything you’re saying rings so true - the slow onset that you meet with accommodation. The step-change degradation of ability as situational windfalls allow it - so sudden that you believe it must be just another extreme mood that will pass by morning, until you realize decades later that your own life changed substantially and irrevocably that day. The disregard or maybe distain for their own bodies, self-satisfied in the rational that it’s their own body and nobody has any interest in it
It's exhausting!
I am in a bit of a downward spiral. I have "dealt" with this by creating my own life, doing my own thing, being involved in various things in the community. I have even gone to workshops and vacations on my own or with friends to catch a break from homelife.
I hope to find a way to climb back out of this. Perhaps the biggest disappointment is in myself for tolerating what was at times intolerable through the years, of hoping against hope, for being so foolish to think this was ever going to change, to perhaps believing that I didn't deserve better. Thanks for listening.
Succumbing to Depression
There's not much I could add or give advise to in your post, but a couple of things caught my eye in what you said about going to the doctor and you attributing this to "ADD" ( or ADHD depending on what country you're from ).
Part of my own frustration ( in figuring out ) what is what....is when I'd read a list of symptoms and they list things, not directly caused my the "ADHD condition" itself. These are the "correlations" ...not the causes you might say. It really makes things confusing especially when you ( the person with it ) is trying to figure out why you feel a certain way but can't seem to pin it down?
Fir myself, I've been able to determine what is directly caused my my ADHD ( executive function) and what is not. From the sound of it....depression is the real issue with your husband...not "ADD". I mean, if you were going to the doctor anyway, I'd start there instead of saying "ADD" becuae it might prove to save you a lot of time, money and frustration trying to figure out what's wrong with him and skip right to the heart of the matter.
As far him succumbing to it ( the depression ) I can't give you any advise or tell you what the answer is for him, or you, or how you need to deal with it. I can't tell you that he's going to get better either since, that's a personal journey and something I cannot speak for another person .
I can say this, which came up in therapy years ago. I was trying to explain "this feelimg" I had going as far back as grade school. I told him it started approximately age 10 or 11.
He said " mmmm, that early..." and scribbled some notes on his pad. I told him I thought it was "growing pains". Well, it WAS painful at the very least, but now I understand it was depression and it started that long ago.
And if didn't know now, what I didn't know then, I'd say depression and anxiety are my two most troubling issues.....without knowing I had ADHD or most likely AuDHD.
Depression is part of the picture, yes--and ANXIETY!
Insightful of you. Yes, my husband had suffered with depression for years. But you also mention anxiety, which is very interesting--a lightbulb just lit up. From me looking in, I would wonder if my husband hasn't become agoraphobic over the last few years. He seems to hate leaving the house. He is also drinking more. I have wondered also about some early onset dementia, to be honest. But I know the ADD has been there all along. I know that dealing with any one of these things on their own is difficult, so dealing with possible multiple issues has to feel debilitating. Regarding anxiety, I think that would be more difficult for some men to "admit" to. But that seems to fit into this picture.
Also..."Admitting"
... I forgot to mention. This thing abou not being able to admit things, is NOT just a man thing. My entire family are completely phobic of admitting anything mental health related. That also I includes the women too. It's a family thing, not a gender related thing in my situation at least.
I think that's all too common
Our whole culture needs to get past that. People are suffering.
Independent
Something in what you just said sparked a memory related to my earlier comments concerning the Alzeimers/Dementia possibility. This is completely unrelated, but still related, in an indirect way.
You started out this post by mentioning "competence" which brings me to this memory I had. It has more to do with what someone believes, based on circumstantial evidence. I'm not directing this memory at you, but more to what you just said...."people are suffering".
I took your comment to mean in a general, cultural way in society, that by not admitting when there's a problem ( a mental health one in particula ) ...people suffer.
When my "card file" gets activated ...it generally means I should stop and take a look. Ive found, that's just how it works. This a "non thinking " thing. It just happens...there's nothing in a cognitive sense involved but on a sub conscious level, I think there are connections to be made.
This memory has to do with my sisters and my mother when she was a virtual invalid that had to be wheeled in a wheel chair. It was decided that, we'd all take my mom for a stroll ( a wheel ) outside. I offered to do the "wheeling" and was pushing my mom along. There was an incline approaching and I was preparing to make am appropriate compensation. Suddenly, my one sister has this panic attack moment and jumps in and and grabs the wheel chair ...almost pulling it out if my hands...as if...I was not competent enough to operate this devise with my mom in it.
It's odd how my card file memory works like this. It'll take me directly to a moment like this....where there's a belief in place...that ( in my case ) my mother safety was in danger because of "my" lack of competence.
And after everything I've even said here, either recently or in the past, the clearly shows, my compentecy level, especially with things that "roll" on wheels....is well above average. In fact, at a level that exceeds most people...disorders or not. My reflexes, my coordination, my fuctional knowledge and operating mechanics in such a thing as a wheel chair and negotiating a mild incline puts me at a level well and above the average individual.
Things on wheels...IS my "wheel house" you might say. Yet ...a fear existed that says...."your not competent"...in aomething as simple as pushing someone in a wheel chair and negotiating a slight incline in the side walk.
I didn't come back here to vent about that moment, I came back to say ..this is self sabotaging behavior. Not MY behavior...but the person who has a belief...that is simply not true. I mean, the utter ridiculousness of that situation is laughable. Yet it happened and it was made very clear to me, why that was.
That's really what I came back here to say. When a belief is made, that is untrue or based on bad information....or people are unwilling to admit there's a problem or admit ...heaven fordid...that there's mental health issues that run in the entire family...it not only sabtages them ( the person with the belief) but it sabotaged others who could possible benefit the person who is suffering. It literally prevents someone who could possibly provide assistance...from proving that assistance because....."they're not competent".
When in fact...they are. In this particular case....beyond more competent, than the person who held the belief.
That sabotages everyone...it's not just "self sabotaging ".
Case in point. ( card file is usually telling me something ). That's one thing I've learned to trust more, as time goes on.
This was my mother's pattern ....
who I highly suspect was undiagnosed ADHD.
This is where I pause, because I have only ONE person who I have any experience with when it comes to Dimentia or Alzeimers which was my own mother. To suggest otherwise, would be making a false claim that I know much of anything about this topic other than her. Having said that, for years after my father passed away, I was her go to person, to help her as needed for certain things around the house. I was there as a regular observer of her behavior, as one sister lived in another state, the other was busy with two small childeren at home.
But yes, the agoraphobic behavior and "chronic" anxiety ie: a very uptight, high strung, nervous person ....as I use to describe her. Constant worrier....always "on". She never seemed able to relax or just chill. That's how she appeared from the outside. She lived right on the edge in other words...despite, having a low stress environment at home.
That's kind of the key in for me. My anxiety, is more situational due to overwhelming stress for too long a time. Generally, externally influenced.
In my mom's case, she had none of that ...as she lived alone and was basically a self imposed shut in. ( the agoraphobia part ). She also was a T-totaller and never drank however.
I was thinking about this the other day because it was around my age that I started noticing the "odd behaviors" in my mom. I use to tell my sisters, but they kind of ignored me at the time. Mostly, it appeared in unusual or different things she'd say which were not her norm.
I had this thought arrive when I noticed how much sharper I've becom, by transitioning to my current state of being. Memory, organization skills, awareness, ability to communicate with people ( my daily interactions ) have actually improved from where it was. The anxiety and stress I was living in is simply no longer there which I think, accounts for this improvement.
Right now, my anxiety is extremel low. I'm also taking no antidepressants or meds for anxiety or panic attacks...which I was, when I was still living under the conditions I was in.
I've never had trouble sleeping, but I was experiencing night terrors and wakeful sleep and feeling tired in the morning.
None of that is happening now, yet I sleep in public places! Lol In fact, last night, I found a nice shady spot out of the sun in a local grocery store parking lot surrounded by people in the late afternoon. I realized, what an advantage it was, having a store full of food ( or any kind I wanted ) just a short walk from my vehicle. I made several trips inside...like going to my refrigerator at home! Lol That was very relaxing in reality. A bathroom also readily available. And I slept like a baby, and woke up feeling refreshed. Just an interesting observation, one I never really thought of before?
But I too have wondered about the chronic state of anxiety affecting my mother over time. This major contrast between my mental state now....and hers at this same age is somewhat validating that I might be on the right path for my own well being.
Her being shut in, completely alone, no one to talk to and being completely isolated...yet still maintaining her normal state of "chronic anxiety" makes me wonder if that didn't have somethin to do with her onset of dementia. In her case, Alzeimers?
It's just such an interesting contrast...with me, sleeping in a grocery store parking lot, under a shade tree...and being worry and trouble free?
I certainly enjoyed having a gigantic refrigerator full of food, only 100ft from my bedroom ! Lol That was about as stress and anxiety free as I can remember in recent history.
Glad for you!
I'm glad things have gotten better for you. What do you attribute it to?
I'm alone !
Actually, being alone helps because I can set things up to optimize myself without any outside constraints. My ADHD symptoms really disappear when I on my own schedule, do things that work for me, and borrow off my strengths. Finding my optimum "sweet spot" and staying there is what I've found works extremely well if nothing else ( or no one else ) gets involved.
But being with, or finding the right person has always seemed to allude me. I can't say I've ever found that "good match" where I can manage myself without causing some kind of problem for the person I'm with. I tend to attract a certain type of partner...who's looking for my "talents" ( to benefit them ) instead of me the person.
In essence,..they appear more interested in what they'll get "from" being with me...instead of getting me ( the person ) ...by being with them.
When I'm not in that situation...I take care of myself just fine especially when I'm lone to use my "talents " for myself. That's what I've found even more recently. When I use my talents for me.....my symptoms almost come pletely disappear aside from a few of the more annoying once. Annoying for me that is ! Lol But for me, those are more just nuisances. I have no problem dealing with them as they come.
Consider something else
Hi. My 65+ y/o ADHD husband was exhibiting similar things for the last 2 years. I thought he was just an old grumpy @$$hole. He has been treated for the last 15 years for depression (not medicated for ADHD bc he claims he doesn't have it) so I thought ADHD was getting worse or his meds for depression were no longer working. I started to pay attention to the ups and downs. His behavior is worse when he is in an unfamiliar environment such as on vacation. Better at home. Awkward when out in a group of friends. Many ADHD symptoms worse than ever...forgetful, poor recall, RSD, blurting out unflattering remarks, paranoia. Then I noticed other behaviors and little things others who know him well would not see. I now suspect he is exhibiting signs of a cognitive disorder. The signs for early dementia and ADHD are similar so those with ADHD are seen as getting worse when they are actually suffering from something else. He is not diagnosed yet, and will likely fight me on getting one. I am keeping a journal of things I see and can't be explained away. A close family member mentioned they had also noticed some odd things after I confided that I thought something other than ADHD was going on. I did a lot of poking around on the internet and discovered that people with unmedicated ADHD have 3 times the risk of developing dementia.
adhd32
Before I read what you wrote, my gut feeling is telling me the same thing. It seems, I'm the only person in my family who was paying close attention to my mother as she transitioned from the person she was, to the person she became.
I didn't write it down, but this unusually accurate "type memory" I have still remember these moments clearly. ( autobiographical scene memory ).
What's interesting to note, as I read what you mentioned about your 65+ year old ADHD husband ....
Assuming my own mother was a 65+ year old ADHD ( woman ), who I had an entire lifetime of history with spanning numerous decades, I see something here that I feel is a fair accessment. Interesting at least...if nothing else.
I liken this to being drunk, that is, drinking past the point of maintaining you're normal decorum. Said differently, you lose your inhibitions. Since my mom was a T-Totaller, it was even more apparent when she started acting like a drunk person without the drinking.
I remember studying this phenomenon in college. About the different types of drunks. And right off the bat...I'm either the "mostly unaffected " type...who's personality doesn't change much, or, If I drink way too much, I'm more the "happy drunk" which bodes well in socal situations with other drunk people at a party. Not the "life of the party" , just happy and laughs even more than I normally do. I'm pretty non offensive mostly, but still more outgoing and less reserved.
And historically, I lose patience with drunks who suddenly start acting weird ( friends in my past ) where I want to just slap them in the face and say "get your shit together boy !! " because theyre being so annoying! Lol But that's just me. I have to be almost staggering ( pin balling off the wall drunk, before I really become offensive! And even then, I'm still laughing most of the time.
So within my theory, that's people's "true selves " emerge when they drink too much and lose their inhibitions....this is precisely what I witnessed with my mom...suddenly, I'm doing that...."who are you? You're not my mom??" thing.
I don't have any bearings when it comes to your husband's personality...before 65+. But if he was like my mom in respect to my theory...his "drunk self" would be the angry or aggressive drunk...the "A hole " type. And I have plenty of experience with this type, as one of my best friends was this one!! I'd be at a party and some strange woman or even a guy would come up to me and say " is that your friend? Did you come here with him? ( I'd be bracing, thinking..." oh no, what did he do this time ? " ) only to find out he had half the party angry with him for being so blatantly hostile and offensive...mostly to women!
And they'd always finish with " you need to take him out of here! " Which I did...telling him " I can't take you anywhere can I ?...you're a menace to society! "...dragging him out by his shirt colliar. Half joking, half serious. And they'd pick me, because I was that other drunk I described. Lol
But staying within my theory...my mom wasn't that type of drunk in keeping with her "true self emerging" when she lost her inhibitions. When she lost her inhibitions, she'd start telling inappropriate stuff about her past with men or...details about my dad in bed . ( virtual fingers in ears ....Flintstones song, playing in my head ) Like ..WAY too much information mom! TMI overload !! She became WAY too outgoing and uninhibited !! That's what I mean about the "who are you? And what did you do with my mom changling!! "
All decorum suddenly disappeared from the extremely reserved and "proper" woman who was my mom, to this drunk version with no inhibitions!
In all seriousnes...that's exactly what she appeared like to me from an observational stand point. And in keeping with my theory, everyone ...man or woman...will have their own "drunk type" emerge which, depending on what chart or reference you use, there are anywhere from 4 to 7 different drunk "personality types" to choose from.