How it Begins
In the beginning, there was the hyper-focus courtship. For many couples where one or both of them has ADHD, the high levels of dopamine that accompany ALL infatuation masked ADHD. This is because ADHD is caused, in part, by low levels of dopamine. ‘Infatuation dopamine’, as I think of it, does a great job of connecting the two of you. If you’re like we were, be both knew quite quickly we wanted to be with the other person. My husband (the one with ADHD) was hyper attentive; thought up amazing, fun and creative things to do together, and had a little bit of a mysterious ‘edge’ to him that made the relationship even more exciting. To him, I was smart, interesting, even-keeled, and fun to be with. We were madly in love and started living together after 3 months. Sound familiar?
Sadly, that extra dopamine wears off between 2 and 2.5 years into your relationship, according to Helen Fisher, author of Why We Love: The Nature and Chemistry of Romantic Love. Suddenly, you are faced with a different person as a partner – someone who shows the signs of ADHD – often distracted; not particularly attentive; having trouble following through and often not on time. Still a great person…just not quite the person you thought you were with. In courtship you envision a life-long partnership with an attentive partner. When that dopamine wears off you are dropped into a distracted, lonely, sometimes angry relationship.
In our case, no one knew about the ADHD. This is common…about 80% of adult ADHD is currently undiagnosed. So there was no explanation, and I suffered - thinking that my husband didn’t love me anymore; that he was mad at me; that I had done something wrong. We fell into ALL of the typical behaviors that couples fall into when they are impacted by ADHD. A symptom would show up (say distraction). I would misinterpret it (thinking he didn’t love me because he wasn’t paying attention to me) and become hurt or angry. He would respond to my comments and/or attacks by being angry back. Soon we were fighting about fighting. There was so much that we didn’t understand back then about what was going on!
In any event, at some point, BOTH partners look back and think “this relationship isn’t at ALL what I thought I had signed up for!” I was sad that the attentive, helpful man I had met now almost never paid attention to me and when I was out of sight I was definitely out of mind. My husband, for his part, was sad that he thought he had married a calm, fun person and had ended up with an angry, harping, unrecognizable witch.
Responses to the realization that this is not at all what you both expected vary – I, for example, said to myself “well, if this is all there is to romance, I might as well start my family!” (Yes, I know, not the first strategy I would now recommend!) My husband’s response was to retreat further from me because it didn’t feel good being with me. Others become bitter and angry, blaming their partner for their difficult lives. Or live in pain, without understanding how to address it – or even that they need to. But this pain does need to be addressed…and if you’re feeling it, please read on.
Why It’s Important to Grieve
Not all couples struggle with ADHD and responses to ADHD. But if you do, then you probably have some grieving to do. Your relationship isn’t what you had dreamed it could be. That doesn’t mean it is a bad relationship for you, even if things are not going well at the moment. And the fact that you feel disappointment or bitterness doesn’t mean that either you or your partner is a bad person. It simply means that you have been impacted by “The ADHD Effect” and have some obstacles to overcome before you will find the happiness you seek. It also means that the form of your happiness will likely be quite a bit different from what you originally envisioned. That’s okay…but to get there, it’s extremely helpful to grieve the fact that your relationship is different from what you expected…and that right now it doesn’t feel all that good.
Why am I such a big fan of grieving? Because until you acknowledge and accept that your reality is quite different from your dreams, you can’t fully enjoy your real life. You’re held hostage by your sadness, which colors many of your interactions. And you may also be ruining the relationship you do have by either clinging to that old dream and trying to change your partner into the person you dreamed he or she would be (as I did) or you may be in ‘fight or flight’ mode either lashing out or retreating (as my husband was). Neither works to connect you.
What IS Grieving?
Grieving is looking at your sadness, regret and pain and, over time, coming to the understanding that there are some things you can’t change. Death, for example, or a horrific accident, or the fact that your child has cancer – these are the kinds of things we normally associate with grieving. ADHD is like that, too. Yes, the two of you can dramatically improve your relationship once you get to a place where you both accept ‘what is’ and also learn ‘what can change.’ But as long as you hang onto your original dreams of the relationship you don’t have, you impede your progress towards finding the happiness you seek in the relationship you do have.
I was speaking yesterday with a woman who told me “I’m a doer – my father had cancer, and up until the day he died I was still looking for the thing that would cure him.” While she has now accepted her father’s death as reality, she’s having trouble grieving her relationship loss because she still wants to believe she can ‘fix’ the ADHD ‘problem.’ She’s not all wrong – we have a lot of influence over how we live our lives. But there are some things that we can’t change – death…and the presence of adult ADHD…are two of them. We can use medical science to stay healthy much longer. We can use behavioral and mental health science to vastly improve life with adult ADHD. But we can’t fully eliminate either of them.*
Grieving is about understanding that we are not as powerful as we would like to be and that while we have influence, our influence has limits.
How Do You Grieve?
Grieving is a deeply personal process, so I will share what I went through and what I have observed others do.
After many years, it could no longer wait. My sadness about the obvious gap between dreams and reality needed exploring. So I journaled. I read. I talked – with friends, sometimes with my husband about my sadness – which he shared. I took better care of myself and taught myself to love myself again so that I was in a position of strength to better take on this pain. I explored what my life was, and I tried to sort out the positive from the negative. That search for the positive was a really important part of my grieving. While I felt hopeless, it was really hard to accept ‘what was.’ It was just too painful! When I could find some positive parts, it was easier to say ‘this is what is…and there are ways to make the good parts better while understanding how to negotiate the bad.’ It made me feel sad to think about the lost years, but also hopeful to think about a better future. While ADHD isn’t changeable, how we deal with ADHD is.
Educating myself about ADHD was critical. When I didn’t understand ADHD, I misinterpreted the symptomatic behaviors – almost always in a negative way. His ‘distraction’ was interpreted as lack of affection rather than a non-emotional symptom. It’s hard, if you don’t understand ADHD, not to feel bitter when you (incorrectly) think the person who is supposed to love you the most no longer does.
As I was doing all of this learning I came to the conclusion that we were both good people who had gotten lost. That we had given it our best (in our own ways) and we had both reacted in ways that were human and understandable. I learned that not only was my husband’s ADHD a huge issue, but so were my responses to his ADHD. I realized that what I needed was to forgive myself for all of the poor choices I had made…and forgive my husband for all of the poor behaviors and choices he had made, too.
I came to a conclusion that helped me greatly as I moved through my grief. We had both done the best we could, with the information that we had had…which turned out to be incomplete because it had lacked the ADHD component.
It’s sad that we didn’t know what we were doing. But I couldn’t hang onto my ignorance forever. If I could accept my own actions and forgive them, and accept my partner’s actions and forgive them, then I could put my sadness into context and move ahead. Yes, we had made many mistakes. Yes, we had had dreams of the perfect relationship, which I now understood were based in that short, hyper-focused courtship phase. I understood why I was sad and felt it was OKAY to be sad…but that continuing to hold onto that sadness wouldn’t change anything.
After finding acceptance, I was ready to take the next step - asking “what do I want this pain I’ve experienced to turn into?” I knew for sure that I needed to create a life in which I was happy and whole and that I was the best person to take responsibility for that. I am responsible for my own happiness – not my husband, or kids, or anyone else.
So I figured out who I wanted to be (certainly NOT that aggressive witch!!) and started acting that way. Armed with knowledge I accepted my husband, and started treating him with empathy and respect. He responded quite quickly – taking on his ADHD issues with more rigor etc. Yes, we had bumps but we did make it through…and it all started with my deciding that I didn’t have as much control as I thought I did…unless I wanted to leave, which I didn’t want to do until I felt confident that all other avenues had been exhausted.
This sort of shift doesn’t change the fact that the struggles of our early relationship aren’t sad. It will always be sad that we spent years in which we could have been happy in a miserable struggle…just as it will always be sad that my mother, who died at too early an age in 2008, has not been around to see the amazing people her grandchildren have become. But in both cases, asking, “what do I want this pain to turn into” is a useful tool. I can use the information and wisdom I’ve gained to (along with my husband) to grab life and create joy – not relying on far off dreams, but right now, today, based on who we really are as people.
*About 20-30% of kids diagnosed with ADHD no longer qualify for a diagnosis of ADHD as an adult. It is unclear why this happens, though it’s thought that some of it might be misdiagnosis and some of it might be putting strong coping strategies in place that manage ADHD to a point of no longer qualifying. Adult ADHD, however, does not go away and, in fact, can intensify with age.
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Comments
Grieving the dysfunction
I agree with so much you said. There’s another level, too. The dysfunction that is inherent from generations of his family having adhd in the line and so no one knows how to be healthy - which made for a hot mess that he grew up in. Both parents horribly mentally and emotionally unhealthy has made him horribly mentally and emotionally unhappy. But again, high levels of dopamine hid a lot of that. I also have to grieve that the person I thought he was - he really isn’t.
~ Brin
Spot on
Oh Brin. . . this is spot on. My husband was raised in an emotional wasteland and a toxic environment that destroyed the mental health of two of his three siblings, so much so that they are on long term disability and have never worked. And deeply affected his mental health too, irrespective of the adhd. My parents (and I) used to say when we started dating, "How did he turn out so well?". Well, it turns out he didn't. It was just hidden deep down and rose to the forefront as soon as our son was born and he deserted me, physically and emotionally.
The non-ADHD partner grieving for the person they will have to b
I wonder in grieving for our relationship do I also need to grieve for the person I can never be. So many things I read suggest that I, the non-ADHD, spouse should jump into my husbands fun& spontaneity. However my husband does not like me to step outside of my role as the calm dependable partner. If is sing too loud or dance too much he gets embarrassed by me. I find this very ironic. He often dances in the isles of Walmart. However I could never without a look of horror on his face. So I cannot as suggested in your book jump onto his side and live a more fun and spontaneous life for a moment. I feel very trapped in the non-fun, all-practical role of wife for a lifetime
Dancing in the Aisles
This sounds to me as if it can be worked through, actually. Because if you don't get to determine how he conducts himself in the aisles of Walmart, he should be able to turn around and dictate whether you can dance there (or the equivalent). This is so blatently unbalanced in terms of fairness that I am thinking that a conversation about the benefits of you BOTH getting to be who you want to be could be productive. You may wish to take a look at my ADHD savvy therapists page and see if there is someone near you who can help you be whom you wish to be...it's not just about you adjusting to him...but also about him adjusting to you.
Dancing...
Dance whenever and wherever you want to.......
:)
Accepting blame for ADHD person's continuing dysfunction
"Armed with knowledge I accepted my husband, and started treating him with empathy and respect. He responded quite quickly – taking on his ADHD issues with more rigor etc."
I made mistakes and it is hard for me to forgive myself for those. Another thing I have a hard time coming to terms with is the attitude, often expressed by some people on this website and in other places, that it is my fault that my ex-husband didn't take on his ADHD issues with more rigor.
NEVER blame yourself... for your ADHDer not taking real responsi
PoisonIny, NEVER blame yourself or accept blame from others for your ADHDer not taking real responsibility for managing his ADHD. He is an adult; he is responsible. If your husband remained in denial despite years of ADHD-symptom chaos, no amount of additional cajoling, encouragement, research or threats would have made a difference. He did not want to change and therefore made little or no effort.
Blame
Don't blame yourself. While I can cheer from the sidelines at a result like the one described, I understand (and have read many accounts on this site and others) that someone who suffers from ADHD may not use this change in a partner as a catalyst for personal change. In fact, sometimes the ADHD partner will use this as another reason to "take." When I made similar changes, it did not create change in my ex H, except so far as make him believe that everything was "ok" as it was because I was no longer harping. Life was better for him, but virtually nothing had changed for me. It was a one way street. In the end, the status quo was more comfortable and less frightening than change or acknowledging that there was a problem to solve.
However, read carefully. I may not be accurate, since I am not the writer of the passage, but it seems to state that he took on the treatment "with more rigor" as if he perhaps (?) was already doing some work on his own and the writer's own behavior changes augmented?? It seems like they both stepped back to assess the situation first and came to a conclusion that it was worth another shot. TWO people... correct me if I'm wrong and if I am wrong, I apologize. It seems to always come down to the issue of two people working on it.
I'm a complete hypocrite in writing this. I also suffer from great regrets and self-blame. It's hard to be on the receiving end for years on end and come out a whole person, as before. I won't be the same person as before. I'm still figuring this out.
But no one else knows what you did, how hard you tried or what kind of resistance you were met with.
Takes two people
Hi - I wrote the passage, and, yes, I am talking about two people working. If only one person is working on the issues then the relationship mau well end because it's just too miserable. You can work and work and work but unless both people say "we need to BOTH figure out how to address this" then what happens is that the person who is doing all the work becomes secondary to 'saving' the relationship rather than getting their needs met. This results in horrible unhappiness for that person, a good deal of anger and frustration and, in many cases, divorce. It's hard (and perhaps humiliating) to stay in a relationship that is all about appeasing the other person. Not to mention unhealthy!
My husband and I both agreed we would prefer to stay together and that we were both willing to make an effort, we just didn't know how to. I did that experiment that another person mentioned here - holding my own counsel - and had EXACTLY the same outcome as she did - my husband thought everything got better since I was no longer harping on him, and I was miserable and ANGRY that he didn't make any changes.
When I am suggesting that improving the environment is in everybody's best interests and is the most likely way to get the involvement of an ADHD partner, I am NOT suggesting one not lobby for one's needs. Rather, I'm suggesting that finding a constructive and palatable way to do that is in your own best interests. You may laugh at the idea of 'palatable' but the reality is that people - ANYONE, yourself included - respond better to a request when it is made in a context that matters to them. For those with ADHD, confrontation, complaining, etc tends to trigger them immediately into a shame/dysfunctional space. This may be because of family of origin issues; it might be from a history of people they care about telling them they could be better. It is often related to the emotional lability issues that people with ADHD face (more emotional more quickly than others). Whatever the reason in your own relationship, if you are finding that what you say is triggering your partner, then you are in conversations where you are likely not to be heard. And many of those conversations actually make things worse.
It's a delicate balance - say things in a way that de-fuse the ADHD reactivity/defensiveness and don't trigger their hyper-sensitivity around perceiving criticism, while still saying things that could be emotional or difficult...and that get your point of view across. But that's the challenge that faces most non-ADHD partners. And I have seen over and over again that it can be done in a relationship where there is a good core connection (or used to be).
If you do create a 'safer' environment for your partner in your relationship, and your partner doesn't respond, then it's definitely time to bring up how you feel about that...what the benefits are to your partner for reciprocating, etc. I have repeatedly seen that putting the benefits in the form of 'this is what you will get out of it' vs. 'this is what I want' can make a big difference. Same info, but wildly different response from the listener. (I didn't make this up - it's the backbone of many books on good negotiation.)
As fro this most immediate comment - that it's hard to be on the receiving end of this for years and come out a whole person...and the sadness of others not knowing how hard you tried, etc. This is part of the reason I wrote this blog post. Because it IS REALLY sad that we try so hard and make no progress...in the most important relationship of our lives. Over time, and after a whole lot of false starts, I concluded that while I had tried hard, I had not used the right tools. Like trying to move a locomotive from point A to point B by pedaling rather than using an engine. I put in lots of intense effort but didn't get anywhere (except into a worse and worse place.) I grieved about all of that for quite a while...and encourage you to do the same...the idea of "I did the best I could do" was great consolation for me...don't know if it will be for you, but I hope so.
You are good
You are smart and tough and human and honest and vulnerable and mature and helpful. I want to add one thought, if I may.
Self doubt, beating ourselves up, terrible bouts with a lack of confidence after repeated failures, being humiliated over and over, take there toll. We need someone on our side, or I should say, we benefit greatly, when someone sees the good in us and believes in us and conveys that belief in ways we can perceive. We thrive on encouragement. Don't be afraid to lavish sincere praise on your SO with ADHD for those things that you do love and appreciate about him/her. I don't think we want or need a parental figure, but rather a true friend who honestly and truly appreciates who we are deep down.
repeat that please
THanks
Thank you for contributing that. I agree. I see all the time what generous support of an ADHD partner can achieve in terms of helping that partner stay on track and take better control of ADHD issues. Also makes a big difference in the affection and warmth department.
Melissa
All the advice feels like blame and a lack of understanding
I,too, feel that the advice aimed at the non partner feels like blame for our inability to accept and empathize. While I now see that some of my reaction, or overreaction, to situations has made some things worse, I also see that not reacting, not commenting, or not responding has caused my H to think things that were previously unacceptable are now okay because there was no push-back from me. H will push boundaries as far as he can and will take the lack of negative response from me as an acceptance of his behavior. If I speak up I am negative, unsupporting, controlling, a know it all, self-righteous, etc .
Grieving for a relationship that will never be is a waste of time to me, I prefer to deal in reality rather than looking back and wondering what if. I thought the man who presented himself was to be was the man I was getting for the rest of my life. I can clearly see who is right in front of me now and he is a complete stranger to the man I married. I see a man who wants to remain an adolescent with no responsibilities, no accountability, no forethought. The advice says I am supposed to accept him as he is while he does nothing to work at the responsibility, accountability, and forethought. Maybe all the grieving is part of a multi-stage process when BOTH parties can see their behaviors' affect on the relationship. But when ADD person will not accept his/her role in the chaos, there is nothing to grieve. By his/her refusal to address the ADD they are communicating that our relationship is not worth the work and therefore, I am not worth the work either. This unspoken message is the most heartbreaking gut punch.
Don't internalize it, they cannot help it, they don't see it, lower your expectations, are all the things we often hear regarding making a relationship work with an ADD partner. So, all the accommodating is made by the non spouse and none of the undone things are to be mentioned because ADD partner might feel criticized when reminded to take out stinking 3 day old trash they will claim they don't see/can't smell. I have nothing to grieve, instead, I have walls and boundaries to protect myself from someone who is not interested in changing. This is my reality in black and white, I see what I am dealing with and have put measures in place after years of disappointment and emotional pain. It is sad that I have to protect myself from the actions of a person who is supposed to be my partner but boundaries are the only way to protect myself from being pulled down with him.
Right on, adhd32
I am so tired of being the one to make the accommodations and empathize. I get absolutely none of this in return from my ADHD partner. He doesn`t want to change a thing or assume responsibility for any of the issues in our marriage. He wants to say he's a husband and father while doing nothing to fulfill those roles except show up at the dinner table for the meal I've prepared. I am sure it might be different with a partner who will acknowledge and address the ADHD. Mine will not.
What a bait and switch this has been, leaving me stuck. If I seek divorce now, I'd likely have to share custody with someone who can't find a pair of underwear to wear in the morning, let alone have healthy food in the house for our child. So here I am, wearing myself down to an anxious, lonely shell of a woman I don't recognize as I parent for two, work FT and manage the household until I am confident I can get custody. I absolutely can not believe where I am.
Being mischaracterized
It sounds as if you are carrying around a heavy load and are bitter about your situation, which I both recognize and feel badly about. However, I do want to correct your interpretation of what I wrote. In your situation, you are talking about denial - your partner is denying that his ADHD makes a difference. Or perhaps you are talking about two different views about how to live life that neither person wishes to budge on. Both can be miserable.
I am NOT suggesting that people with ADHD 'can't help it' - in fact, I spend a lot of time teaching those with ADHD just how they CAN help it and why they should get involved in fixing their relationship - why the MUST get involved if their relationship is going to last. Furthermore, I am also not suggesting that non-ADHD partners should just let themselves get run over by their ADHD partner's 'idiosyncrasies.' Who the hell would want a relationship like that?1 As Harriet Lerner, author of The Dance of Anger would say, 'anger is inevitable if you are giving in and going along.' I've been down that road - giving in and going along simply doesn't work. It concerns me that this may be what you are doing by building up your boundaries...and that 'protecting yourself' may not be enough of a place from which to find satisfaction.
In any event, I'm suggesting a more subtle approach -one in which YOUR needs DO get met...and your partner's issues with ADHD are also recognized and incorporated. Let's take the 3 day old stinking trash example you bring up so bitterly. If you and your husband work working together on this then he would recognize that this was his job - ALWAYS his job - and he would find a way that fits with his ADHD mind to take it out. That would NOT be waiting until it smells or remembering it without a reminder. From your brief description, it sounds as if those non-ADHD ways of noticing don't work for him. That fits with what I know about folks with ADHD - they often don't see things that seem really obvious to non-ADHD folks around them. The ADHD partners are too distracted by other things or are too much in their own heads or simply too interested in something that's more fun. That's the explanation for WHY they might not notice the stinking trash, but it's not an EXCUSE to continue not to notice the trash. So...your husband would have to come up with something that DID work for him. That might be a note on the refridge - TAKE OUT TRASH ON TUESDAY - or an audible reminder on his phone or a written reminder on his calendar - whatever his reminder system is.
At this point you may be laughing (or crying) and saying "WHAT reminder system??? My husband doesn't have a reminder system!" and that would be exactly the point. As long as taking out the trash isn't part of his functioning system (whatever it is that works for him) then you, at least, will be frustrated by the results. (He might not be frustrated by the results because it's not even on his radar screen - he will only be frustrated at the point you yell at him or say something to him that makes him realize he forgot it...which makes YOU look like the bad guy...rather than placing the responsibility where it belongs - with him.) Anyway, a good reminder system is part of every functioning ADHD person's life and a very basic first step to doing better with things like the trash. You might not need that note, but he does...along with a desire to do it at all, vs. just leave it for the adult in the house to pick up after him.
Anyway, that's just one example, and there are about a bazillion of them in your lives, but the basic concepts are the same: ; if you both accept that ADHD is hard to live with and that he is more likely to do things when he does them in a way that is ADHD-friendly, then his success rate goes up and you both feel better about the relationship...or at least about the trash, which he has now taken on more successfully.
But I digress...you write "I'm supposed to accept him as he is while he does nothing to work at his responsibilities" and that your husband wants only to be a child. That's NOT what I'm saying. Yes, he does get to be who he wants to be, just as you get to make the choices in your own life (even if it doesn't feel as if you are in control, you are the only person making your own decisions.) I am not saying 'accept him as he is.' In fact, just the opposite - I tell ADHD partners all the time "Don't just expect your partner to just accept your ADHD when you aren't managing it. You have a responsibility to be a good partner and there are some basic 'rules' for that, such as treating your partner with respect. If you aren't doing that, and using your ADHD or your partner's anger as an excuse, you aren't holding yourself to a high enough standard and need to shape up."
He doesn't get to be a 'bad' partner to you and stay with you unless you decide to let him, in which case you are complicit in your own misery...though there are good reasons to strike that bargain - keeping a family together, serious health issues and financial need are several I've come across. In which case there is some positive that isn't getting enough air time. But by the same token, you don't get to be a bad partner to him, either. So yelling at him in frustration or telling him he's failed yet again to be an adult (or some version of one of those) also is problematically disrespectful. The reason I spend as much time as I do trying to explain the subtleties of this balancing act isn't because I'm trying to get non-ADHD partners to suck it up and just live with and accept ADHD. It's because BOTH partners are typically contributing unhealthy behaviors to the relationship...but often, BOTH partners insist that it's all on their partner and that their own actions are justified. I work hard to shake both folks out of that pattern as owning your own issues is the key to real growth and a healthier relationship.
That said, perhaps the boundaries you have set up in order to survive are the right approach for you. If so, you may wish to engage in the grieving process if you can (grieving that those boundaries need to be set up at all) and then set about finding joy in your life so that you can let go of some of the bitterness it seems you are feeling...it seems to me that would make your life happier, regardless of what your partner is of doing.
I responded to you simply because I thought you were mischaracterizing what I had intended to communicate - so I wanted to clarify, in case the misunderstanding was created by what I had written before.
I appreciate your thoughts
Thank you for responding, I appreciate that you took the time to respond. I think your advice is on point if you are in a relationship with someone who is willing to work at being a better partner and truly wants to change. I do not have that kind of partner, and that is something I have accepted.
Then divorce him…
If you're unhappy with him, divorce him. How would you feel if someone came in to your life and tried to change everything about you to accommodate their needs? It would make you feel like an object or a means to an end wouldn't it ? So if you're unhappy, leave and go find someone without ADHD who you can accept and stop torturing your husband. It sounds like he would be better off alone than with someone who doesn't accept him anyway. Non-ADHDers need to just live in their own worlds together and leave us alone. All your "fixing" is so damaging
This. All of this.
Not sure if you are still on this forum but I'm sitting in my living room late at night and just SAD. I'm so sad and I'm trying to find something to read/consume that will help me and I came across this response and felt so seen, so heard and so understood. I have read it now 10x over and wonder how you are doing today and if you re-reas what you wrote, do you feel the same?? Have you changed any of your advice?? Im so interested to know how the last few years have been....as someone who is alone. Tired, frustrated ans feeling every word you typed.
Still here, still married
Since I wrote this my life has changed. I still feel the same as I did then even after the admonishment from Melissa. Things are better because I put my foot down. We were at a cross road in our lives and when H retired we discussed moving. Many friends already had moved away or passed away and life in the big city was becoming torturous. I countered with going our separate ways which was somehow a shock to him since he was happy and getting his needs met and clueless to my unhappiness. We moved 650 miles away and started a new chapter. Suffice it to say it was a nightmare getting it done. I made an effort to find new friends through a FB newcomers group and he was jealous I had somewhere to go and was happy to be with others while he sat home alone. He eventually joined and met several friends but is critical of minor habits he finds annoying in them. We have had several big blowouts because he is unhappy even though in his mind this move was going to fix everything. He is happy to die a day at a time while sitting in his chair smoking and scrolling I can no longer be controlled anymore. I am not home much, I have daily activities I enjoy. He would prefer I was sitting home not out having fun without him. Why? He ignores me when I am home but the second I'm going out he gets annoyed. I moved on from being his crutch. Our group is mostly newcomers and it was a revelation for me to find people, both men and women, who were interested in what I have to say. Some even say I'm funny. He is now jealous of my friends. I gave him back all his responsibilities he dumped on me for years that have no effect on my life. I let him be wrong and tell half truths instead of trying to set things straight in conversations. I let him feel the consequences of his public disrespectful behavior to others without jumping in to smooth things over. When he tries to pull me in to side with him, I walk away. I love my new life which I wasn't sure I wanted. He pushed to moved 650 miles only to spend his day staring at his phone. Happiness comes from within. I cannot change him or make him see that his unresolved issues from childhood contribute to his over reaction and poor coping methods. He is nearly 70 so I don't expect much change. I live for myself now and he is free to be whatever he wants which apparently is a grumpy old man.
Delighted!
Though the move was hard, it is SO wonderful that you are now in a space where you are getting the appreciation you deserve! Bravo! You are responsible for you, and he is responsible for him.
Melissa
Grief
This is a good post and one which if I had read years ago when I was first learning about the struggles in my relationship and how they may be related to an adhd effect the post would have resonated with me and given me hope. I did grieve the marriage I thought I was going to have and have gone through the stages to mourn (I think. . . although it is always a work in progress. . ). Now what I am grieving is the relationship I thought we could have armed with knowledge and strategies that help adhd-affected relationships. Now I'm grieving the relationship I saw outlined in books and in your courses and on this website.
What I've learnt through the years of reading and doing courses through Melissa, is that the advice and the feelings of empathy are so important to move through and work on strategies that can help the relationship. If those aren't there on both sides, you're toast. Melissa - you were incredibly lucky to have a husband that worked on his treatment with rigor and worked through shame (if there was any shame for him associated with adhd). Without that, would this website and these books even have come to fruition?
My husband is incapable of empathy and compassion; his denial runs so deep that there is no more hope for us. And I do know it is not my fault, and I'm not a nag, or a witch or the a b%tch or a c*nt, or the other myriad of words he throws at me to make himself not be accountable for anything.
I used to have so much hope, now I have none. Just a long road looking at separation and divorce.
So sorry
I thank you for the note and am so sorry at the outcome of your journey. You may remember from my course that denial causes divorce - in this case the denial may be the result of a lack of empathy and compassion. That doesn't make it any easier. You have done the work you need to do to understand the limits of your own role...and to know that you have tried your best with the best tools that are available for you. I hope that even as you feel the grief you feel and realize that your relationship is coming to an end, that you also can take heart in knowing that you did not give up easily and you tried your best...perhaps making the grief a bit easier...or shorter. Separation and divorce are not at all easy, but sometimes they are the only option and it sounds as if this is one of those cases. I'm sending you a virtual hug, and I wish you the best.
Thank you
Thank you, Melissa, for your thoughtful note. It's been a long journey, and the journey will continue, but I feel that I have tried my best and now I'm ready to do the best that I can with a focus instead on my children and my own mental health.
Grieving, and how it ends.
With my ex, it was a damned if i did, damned if I didn't. Say nothing to avoid verbal abuse and criticism, he assumes everything is peachy, and he gets his way. If I pushed back or responded in any way, things usually escalated, with him full blown raging at me.
It was a long grieving process for me. The man that was so loving and gentle in the beginning was not the man I ended up with. I was numb when I filed for divorce. My ex said to me: "I'm just a paycheck to you!". After over a decade of no empathy or compassion from him, no accountability and blaming me for everything....what else was he good for?
GrievingI am
I just read your post. Boy I can relate, my husband has used those same words on me. I found that he threw these accusations at me to deflect anyone from seeing he had issues to deal with, this helped me not to take it too personally.
I hope with the divorce you can begin having happy times and living again. Life sure isn’t a Disney story is it?
Have hope!
Grieving
Melissa, I value your empathy. For most of my married life I have felt like the walking wounded. Carrying on with a spouse with ADHD can be lonely. I needed to have anyone acknowledge my pain and grief, yet there was no corpse. Many rally around those with visible disabilities and lend support. Not so with my husband’s disability. I chose to honor him and not talk smack about him, but when I did break down and share, no one got it.
May I gently suggest to all readers, get counseling for yourself. If you think it is expensive try divorce. I even went so far as to earn my masters in counseling at 58...worth every penny and I have the school loan to prove it.
Lucky for me I married my best friend so I didn’t want to leave him. Yes he still drives me crazy, but pobodies nerfect!
Have hope!
Therapy: I did it. It
Therapy: I did it. It helped. One of the things my therapist helped me see was that my husband was not going to change.
Divorce: I got a divorce. It was less expensive than staying married would have been.
Best friends: My ex has said I was the best thing that ever happened to him. I have a really hard time putting together being the best thing that ever happened to him and being the person who he abandoned to become his mom's full-time nurse and his dad's full-time slave.
A thing I don't forgive myself for: Getting married to a person who was dishonest to and about me from the get-go.
A thing I do forgive myself for: Staying married until our children were grown and safely launched.
A thing for which forgiveness is not necessary: Getting a divorce.
Divorce
It has really helped reading these posts!!! My husband is in denial that adhd has any impact on our marriage. I too am to blame for my reaction to his adhd. We went thru counseling only because I thought he was having an affair. Now I believe that it was someone new and exciting that he worked with. Which he is easily drawn too. The real elephant in the room during the counseling was the adhd. We were supposed to spend 1 hour a day doing something together or talking. Well that didn’t happen. He was just too busy. I truely love him but tonight he asked for a divorce. After 21 years. I guess there was a small part of me that thought he really did love me and want to work things out. But I was wrong. I had given him a Valentine’s Day card saying I will always love and care about him but got nothing from him except that he wants a divorce. He is unhappy. How do I survive this? I thought we could hang on till our son left for college. He is a junior now. I worry about how this will affect him!!! Is there life after adhd? I’m feeling really horrible!!! Is there something I could have done? If anyone is out there with some advice I’d like to hear it!!!
Alone
I'm sorry, Alone.
I'm sorry, Alone.
When you ask whether there's life after ADHD, do you mean after divorce when one of the people has ADHD?
I've been divorced for three years. I filed for divorce; my H claimed that he wanted to stay married but he had withdrawn from the relationship, first emotionally, then physically (he went to live with his parents) several years earlier. I think he didn't and doesn't know how to work on relationship issues so when we started having them, he ran away.
I'm doing okay. I mean, I'm sad that my marriage ended, and I miss my ex. But I couldn't force him to stay engaged in the marriage. My life is probably better now; his seems worse. That doesn't give me pleasure; it's just the way things are.
This is so helpful
Thank you for posting it... It helps clarify a lot of what I'm feeling.
Alone
I am so sorry you are facing this hard time. This group of “posters” has helped me feel not so alone. Sounds like you have had your heart beaten up, and on Valentine’s Day too. Hopefully you won’t feel so alone as you continue to post.
Journaling helps me, even this morning things kind of hit the fan with my husband. Getting all the thoughts and feelings out of your head may lighten your load. Writing out all the grief, regret and mess, even if all I did was scribble, released a lot of pent up emotion.
Sometimes divorce is the only option regardless of the timing. For me, getting myself healthy has been a good role model for my kids to see. I am now, most of the time, able to act from a secure base instead of react from a wonky one.
You are not alone, there is a whole bunch of us right next to you!
Have hope!
Thank you for the support
Today we had another “discussion “. I was always hanging on with a glimmer of hope we could work things out. But today that glimmer is gone. He is dead set on divorce. It seems like he can’t wait. He told me he has 20 years to do what he wants before he is 75 and too old. What about me? I guess with adhd there is never WE. Just him. He has grand plans for the rest of his life. All I wanted was for him to be happy. We were when we were young. Now I’m older and was looking forward to spending time with him and actually doing some of the fun things we used to do before kids. Now I will be alone while he is off full filling his dreams. It’s sad because I still love and care for him even though the road has been rocky. He has shown little interest in our relationship. I’m sorry just ranting out of extreme hurt!!! I wish I had a spouse that realized that adhd is a problem.
Alone
I'm sorry for what you're going through
I'm sorry you have to go through this. It will of course hurt. All break ups do. But perhaps more so because you felt you were working towards a common goal (retirement together) and that's been shattered. Sometimes we choose opportunities for change, and sometimes they're thrust upon us against our will. Perhaps this is an opportunity for you to find someone who will invest the care and time in a relationship with you, which you do deserve. It will be painful to move on, but if you can say, "I tried everything and it didn't work," it may be easier, as you will have no "what if's". Just know that you deserve so much better. You deserve to be loved and cherished and to be with someone who cares about your dreams, hopes, thoughts, and aspirations, and who wants to share their life plans with you and hold your hand on the journey.
I'd say, lawyer up, buckle up, and remember there will be light at the end of the tunnel, no matter how dark the entrance may be.
Big hugs x
Thank you
Wow thanks for the post!! It is so hard to believe there are people out there that have no empathy or caring. Your post made me feel so much better about myself . After years of rejection and loneliness you are just beaten down!! It’s hard to think that I’m worth anything!! I can’t tell you how much the encouraging words lifted me up!!! You are right I need to buckle up for the long road ahead.
Alone
I'm glad to have helped in
I'm glad to have helped in what little way I could. You are worth something. You're worth A LOT! Steel your resolve with the knowledge that you deserve happiness. Try and get your affairs in order so as to not prolong the legal process any more than necessary, and seek support and help wherever you need it. Divorce is a major life stressor (right up there with death of a loved one), but for your own sake, you need to make sure you get the best outcome that you can. Your husband may think this is his chance to live a new life, but guess what, it's your chance too, and it's definitely your turn to be happy. x
I relate
Gosh what you wrote really resonated with me. My husband moved out as he thought our relationship was on the rocks. Rather impulsively of course after a few weeks he realised it was a mistake but enjoyed some aspects of being alone indeed just doing what he wanted. He always refers to having enough money for his retirement.... and your point about there is no we in ADHD is so true. Xxx anyway he has chosen to come back from January
,"Educating myself about ADHD
"Educating myself about ADHD was critical. When I didn’t understand ADHD, I misinterpreted the symptomatic behaviors – almost always in a negative way." Orlov
Learning that our behavior is not directed at our SOs can take the pressure off them. You got it, Ms. Orlov. Great insight. Tough to internalize. I've been hoping to make that point. It isn't as though I choose to splatter my ADHD symptoms all over others, especially the ones I care for the most. "You always hurt the ones you love" comes to mind. "I am what I am and that's all that I am" Popeye used to say. In fact, it hurts me to know that somehow I'm screwing up again when all I truly wanted was to be the best mate/employee/student/friend/sibling/child I could be. There's an agony in there. "I did it again," clueless what it was I did.
For example, you say, Let's eat out at a nice restaurant tonight." I say, "Great idea." You make plans. What I thought you said was, "eating at a restaurant would be fun." So, I wonder when might be a good time to take you. An hour later I get hungry and make myself 10 hot dogs for a snack. You see me and say, "Aren't you going to spoil your dinner? BTW, what time are we heading out?" "Where are we going?" "Out for dinner. You said you would take me tonight." "I did?" And away we go off into an established pattern of twilight zone confusion, disappointment, anger and guilt.
Big deal, right? Of course not. Except, when it occurs 10,000 times in various forms over the days, weeks, months, years, decades you are together, it takes its toll. It sounds goofy but it is a painful, lonely hell.
repeat that please
appreciation
Thanks for that insightful comment about appreciating our partners with ADHD. I guess for me I tried so hard to take care of things around the house/yard etc so that my ADHD spouse had time to focus on the things he needed to focus on or wanted to focus on. However that was not me. I would do nice things for him always on holidays or just because. I would make sure he had his coffee ordered, food he liked, M &M's on his desk etc. to let him know I was thinking of him. They may not always be words - but actions speak louder than words. Plus when does the ADHD'er have time to hear these words - they are off doing something with someone else or spending time doing something else while the spouse sits home and wishes it was her/him. I guess this all does not matter anymore since my husband filed for divorce. Now he is free and Im left with picking up the pieces of a life I thought would be with him.
Alone
Based on your posts, it's easy to see that you love him Alone...
But, it's also perfectly clear he hasn't returned it....I think (hope) in time, you will see the hopelessness you had attached yourself to....No one deserves to not be loved and appreciated by their spouse....The actions, not the words....
Blessings
c
Just so you know
it seems to me that you have some very nice, sweet qualities with intelligence to boot. I bet you've been a good mom. I bet you've offered your son some genuine compassion and support.
Prozac can be a wonderful tool to help those bereft of hope. There are other SSRIs too that might make a big difference for you. Please see a doctor if you feel it might be helpful.
I'm so glad I didn't take off and leave my daughter without her daddy to rely upon always. There's nothing "out there" than can match the beauty, the joy, the satisfaction of being her dad as the committed spouse to her mom. I couldn't bear the pain of hurting her by leaving her mom, by leaving our family. and there really is nothing that can take their place. No amount of money, fame, fast cars, beautiful sandy beaches, no horse racing event, no nothing. Everywhere I go, there I am. I can run but I will not find anything to compare with having them in my life.
I have no doubt you can build a wonderful life for you, your son and with your new relationships. This man saw something so awesome about you that he made an all out commitment to you. If anything, you are more wonderful than ever. I don't think you have lost any of the appeal he was drawn to.
repeat that please
Thanks!!
Thank you so much for your positive comments!!! You really made my day!!! See you see the whole picture why we are here on this earth. We are here to have relationships and to love those around us - you are right it is not about "things" because things do not buy happiness - it is the relationships we nuture. Time is the greatest gift you can give anyone. Thats how people say they love you!. I have to say I am very blessed. I have a great family and lots of friends behind me. I started in a Divorce Care group that is another form of support.
My biggest concern is my son. He is a great kid but it is going to be really hard on him. Is this all worth it? My husband thinks so.
I love how you are committed to your spouse!! You see the whole picture of life. Your daughter is the icing on the cake!!!!.
Thanks for your kind post!!!
Alone
I can assure you
if you really knew me, you'd be throwing up.
You know how I learn? Life takes me by the neck and throws me around and pounds me into the ground until I'm just about dead. I have never learned anything valuable without being bloodied, black and blue and near death. So, thanks for the kind words! If only I deserved a few of them.
You seem more upbeat, more certain that you are important no matter what your husband might do, and that is so cool. I always want to grow and be happy, but it seems pain is the force behind any progress I make toward becoming a better man. The pain you are going through doesn't need to be wasted. Like C said, if it doesn't kill us, it makes us stronger.
repeat that please
Alone....Just wondering, something seems a miss.....
Your husband's actions (wanting a divorce) are not common in my experience,,, When a spouse (adhd or not) has had life in their favor for 20 years, not to mention children....Leaving isn't usually their idea....Unless there is something else driving it.....Is your husband having an affair?
c
You make an interesting point
You make an interesting point.
When I divorced my husband, he didn't want it. He got his way the majority of the time, had a wife who did everything, and two children. A good life for the most part .
Without me, he had no one else to blame his problems on.
Ex wife adhd
Was married to my ex -wife for 8 years 10 together. Our marriage went the same adhd route , had the same dynamics that most marriages go when one spouse is undiagnosed. I new something was off, wrong etc. For a few years but trying to be the good husband didn’t say anything to my ex about all her issues that she had. She had almost every one of the ADHD symptoms; couldn’t get out of bed, late for everything, her desk a disaster, junk everywhere , you get the picture. The parent child dynamic started around when our 2 kids were 3& 4 years old.. it really did feel like I was taking care of 3 kids. I guess I started resenting her because she wasn’t dependable/ was doing her part in our marriage. We started drawing farther & farther apart. I still loved her deeply. In the last couple years of our marriage she kept telling me she couldn’t keep up & l would say honey we have two kids to raise & I no that it’s hard but what could I do to help. She would respond by saying we needed to spend more fun time together. Just seemed she wanted to party & go out all the time & not pay much attention to our kids. In the fall of 2014 she ask for separation. Earlier that summer I finally started to realize she may have adult adhd. In a very kind and emphatic way I mentioned her symptoms & mentioned about getting a diagnosis. That made her really mad. That conversation drew father apart yet. I came to understand what was causing our issues. She was in total denial! We got divorced at the end of 2015. I didn’t want the divorce at all. We share custody 50/50. Fast forward to fall 2018. My ex- finally tells me she had gotten the adhd diagnosis. She said she started taking meds. She still is in complete denial that her adhd had anything to do with our dimise. She still lots of times can’t get our kids to practices on time, late for school sometimes, late for work a lot & on & on with the symptoms. I know it’s out my control but it is so hard because she keeps hurting our kids by embarrassing them because their late so often. I need help ! What can I do to help this situation?
Aaron Eberlin
This is my greatest fear
Your post is exactly what I am afraid of and the reason I don't yet leave my ADHD husband. Once our child is in his care, her life will be a mess and I will have no control or way to help her. Unfortunately, you didn't get to make that decision as your wife made it for you. Do you think parenting still overwhelms her? Maybe she would be open to shifting more days to you if you could find a way to approach her in a friendly way without raising her defenses. ("I've got more time in my schedule coming up and was wondering if the kids could skip the stress of switching houses and stay with me on Tuesday and Wednesday.") Or something! Failing some sort of friendly and cooperative approach, maybe you can document every late or missed drop-off, homework not done, child complaint, etc. on her watch (over a few months) and get more custody through the courts. I know that's awful, but maybe you would be the perfect weekday parent while she would thrive on weekends when there isn't so much of a schedule to follow.
Otherwise, I don't know. My only idea given the situation as it is would be therapy to help you see that you are doing all you can with your 50% and that you have done your best and aren't responsible for what happens the other 50% of the time. I can say for me it would be difficult to get there, but I have met some people who co-parent with seemingly impossible people and they have learned to let it go and focus only on what they can control.
I am so sorry for your situation.
This Thing
I enjoy reading your material Ms. Orlov. You really are offering great insights and workable ideas for couples cursed and blessed with this "Thing." Great stuff. Groundbreaking, and I have no doubt this will become a model for therapeutic interventions for us.
You know what is a big challenge for me? I have a terrible habit of getting tired of anything once I get used to it. I want the new "thing" to be exciting forever, and nothing ever is. Sooner or later, I get used to whatever it is. My way of dealing with that is to race away to find the next new thing or to run from that reality into addictive mirages or to become depressed because nothing can produce the thrill of the new to endure forever.
It never dawned on me to slow way down, to put the brakes on big time and allow life itself to unravel in small, moment by moment, tiny little segments, doing the next right thing. This way, life has become more exciting than I could have imagined.
I wouldn't be surprised if we discover that one of the best ways to reach the unreachable ADHDers is for one ADHDer to reach out to another ADHDer and to express what it feels like to be an ADHDer. No lecturing. No condemnation. No pressure. Simply, "Here's what it was like for me growing up and as an adult..."
repeat that please
Melissa: how long did you grieve?
Question: how long did it take you to grieve?
My husband appears to be in complete denial. We’ve been in this place for so long that I think I need to just begin grieving for the point of moving on in my heart. I don’t want to leave him for several reasons, so I don’t mean moving on in that way. I mean I can’t stay in this place of perpetual agony. I have to grieve the past AND the future.
I’ve already been so angry and sad for so long... how will this be any different than that? I don’t expect you to have the answer to that one. More of a rhetorical question.
I just know I’m tired of being sad and hurt. I wish I could just turn it all off.
~ Brin
Grieving
We have been married for 35 years and after 6 years of failed marriage counseling discovered my partner had ADHD. I am definitely in the grieving process and trying to trust but he hasn't found a medicine that works for him yet. My problem is, I feel my spouse is putting out a timeline or expectations for how long I should be grieving and when I should be starting therapy. I have worked hard to not push his timeline of getting diagnosed, finding a med doctor and finding a therapist, which has taken several months, but I feel he expects me to read a chapter and change that same day though we're stuck in some pretty bad patterns. He asks all the time for time to think and space but expects me to have it all figured out and say everything correctly now. How long is reasonable to grieve?
Grieving
Grieving is different for everyone. However long it takes you is however long it takes you. It's not fair for him to put a time constraint on you.
Also, if you are open to going to therapy you need to find one that you are comfortable with.
past grieving
At point, i've come to grips that this is a problem. I can't fix him, and the only thing i can do is fix myself and move on. That part i've got. Now, the only problem is trying to get out of this crappy small town, and get a decent job in the midst of a Covid pandemic.
So about this pain.
What the hell do I do with it? He knew he was ADHD a long time ago before we even met. He stopped being treated. After demonstrating what a decent, kind person he is, the honeymoon was over, and the household appliance installed. That's me! But I don't say anything about that stuff, it just goes by because I try to understand his brain. I only fuss about things that hurt my feelings. Now he says he doesn't want to hurt them, and I should always treat him as if he didn't realize it, that it's unintentional. He now expects acceptance without comment, or continuous positive regard, and attacks me if I say anything even remotely negative, blows it up into something I didn't even think, accuses me of those things, tells me what and how to think, or tells me my withdrawal is bitchy RSD, and it's mean to him. So, if nothing I say will make a difference, why try to communicate? Withdrawal seems my best option. I can't do the loyal dog no matter what you do to me thing for very long without losing my mind, and my last shred of dignity. If everything we have to work out has to go through this process of cruel defensiveness and dismissal and I'm never heard, what's the point of participation?